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I worked for Apple Authorized Service Providers for over ten years and Apple's documentation is extremely basic at best. Step by step guides that explain how a

by bimguy 3y ago

I worked for Apple Authorized Service Providers for over ten years and Apple's documentation is extremely basic at best. Step by step guides that explain how a part should be replaced, what tools they "require", ect. iFixit docs are essentially the same and sometimes much more detailed then Apple's bare documentation. Although the diagnostics can be helpful sometimes, these are also extremely basic diagnostics, nothing that you would praise Apple for creating. The only thing that might be useful for third party providers is Apple's Screen Calibration machine, which is the only exciting tool that we ever received from Apple(for ridiculous amount of money). I'm sure independent providers found a way around all of these things many moons ago but it's good to know going forward that they can have the same tools for extraordinary prices.

mrtksn 3y ago
On the other hand, I see amazing machines for phone repair from China. They will separate the screen to layers and replace the faulty part instead of the full screen assembly or they will find a defect in the OLED and fix it with laser or something. That's why I'm not very interested in this "right to repair" stuff - it revolves around demanding modular parts for quick and easy replacement. People who are actually close to the metal, who actually get their hands dirty are repairing those devices since ever. I got my old iPhone 6s screen repaired(front glass replaced, keeping everything else original) for very cheap and just in few hours. Here is one for fixing faulty OLED iPhone screens: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks-lS11TIaY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks-lS11TIaY
- bimguy 3y ago
  It's amazing how much more advanced the third party repairers are then Apple's own Authorized repairers. You are completely on point with not being interesting in this "Right To Repair" rhetoric that I can only assume Apple is using as a marketing gimmick. From when I first started fixing Mac's - which I only ever replaced parts, Apple would never allow you to take a soldering iron to their godly products - they at least had a lot of parts you could replace. Displays could be replaced on Macbooks from the 2007 era for example and you could buy those displays in bulk for a reasonable price. From the unibody/clamshell era, 2010 onwards, Apple made these machines barely repairable, displays are now industrially glued into their metal housing, almost all I/O is soldered to the logic board requiring a full replacement to fix, good luck if you're out of warranty. In exchange for the faulty part back, Apple will offer an authorized provider about 20-30% discount on the part which they call an "Exchange Price". Nothing hurt my soul more then to have to quote customers $700-900 AUD (exchange price) to fix a simple backlight malfunction. Interestingly the price of replacing a Display or a Logic Board through Apple's 'Exchange' program is the same cost price for a Service Provider and these are the most costly parts of a Mac. They do not offer exchange prices to these independent providers and the 'stock' price of Apple's service parts are astronomical. I highly doubt that any independent repairer has ever ordered any part from Apple. Maybe they ordered tools, Apple does have some decent tools.
- trifurcate 3y ago
  > I'm not very interested in this "right to repair" stuff - it revolves around demanding modular parts for quick and easy replacement. People who are actually close to the metal, who actually get their hands dirty are repairing those devices since ever. It also involves demanding access to proprietary ICs and information like schematics. A component level repair might become impossible if you don't have access to a vendor-specific replacement for some burnt battery charging IC. You can't really fix up a silicon die like you can a dead pixel.
- voidwtf 3y ago
  "Right to repair" isn't all about demanding modular parts, in most cases right-to-repair proponents aren't even asking the manufacturer to sell them parts. Right-to-repair advocates want the "option" to repair their own device at the very least. Manufacturers of devices are starting to intentionally brick devices when the replaced parts have not been specifically paired with the device. They're using the smokescreen of "security" to justify this, but with no options to accept the security implications. Imagine replacing a windshield in your car, and the car refuses to let you turn on the windshield wipers until you activate the windshield with the manufacturer. The manufacturer will not activate 3rd party windshields. Or imagine replacing the seatbelt spool/cartridge in your car, and the car refuses to stop dinging because the part has not been activated by the manufacturer. This is what manufacturers are slowly doing to all devices and parts. Between excuses of security and wanting to control the user experience, it's all anti-consumer BS.
  - mrtksn 3y ago
    Right, that trend is worrying. Yet, everything is still made of atoms. The people who complain about, Coded parts are people who don’t actually do any repairs. They just swap parts and they are having the issue of parts refusing to work. Instead of replacing modules, you can repair parts. Beneath the abstractions, everything is very simple and obeys the laws of physics. You can’t actually encrypt glass, what’s manufacturers can do is just putting some chip to the components.
    - seec 3y ago
      That's nonsense. There are many parts that often end up in a state where they are effectively unrepairable. And even if they were, it more often than not makes no sense to repair them manually when they are machines that churn dozens of them per second for unbelievably cheap. You just need access to them. How would you repair a fried IC on a mobo if you don't have access to the said? You plan on doing atomic level repair on a 10c parts? If you get a speaker assembly, destroyed by water, pressure or whatever: do you swap the 30c, 20mm part with a new one or spend hours disassembling the thing by hand? Once I spent hours repairing a touch ID button. I had to micro solder the encryption chip with fly wire (finer than a hair) from the old broken button to the new one. All this is essentially because Apple is incompetent enough to design stuff in a better way and wants to prevent people doing it. All this so they can sell a new phone because the price they are going to quote for this repair will make no sense to the user. I want to say there surely are better ways than this, but it is an understatement. You can say whatever you want but this needs fixing, and it does not happen without strong political support and new laws... The way companies can prevent people getting their stuff fixed cheaper because of artificial limitation is ridiculous. And Apple is leading the way with this.

by bimguy 3y ago

mrtksn 3y ago

On the other hand, I see amazing machines for phone repair from China. They will separate the screen to layers and replace the faulty part instead of the full screen assembly or they will find a defect in the OLED and fix it with laser or something. That's why I'm not very interested in this "right to repair" stuff - it revolves around demanding modular parts for quick and easy replacement. People who are actually close to the metal, who actually get their hands dirty are repairing those devices since ever. I got my old iPhone 6s screen repaired(front glass replaced, keeping everything else original) for very cheap and just in few hours. Here is one for fixing faulty OLED iPhone screens: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks-lS11TIaY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks-lS11TIaY

bimguy 3y ago
It's amazing how much more advanced the third party repairers are then Apple's own Authorized repairers. You are completely on point with not being interesting in this "Right To Repair" rhetoric that I can only assume Apple is using as a marketing gimmick. From when I first started fixing Mac's - which I only ever replaced parts, Apple would never allow you to take a soldering iron to their godly products - they at least had a lot of parts you could replace. Displays could be replaced on Macbooks from the 2007 era for example and you could buy those displays in bulk for a reasonable price. From the unibody/clamshell era, 2010 onwards, Apple made these machines barely repairable, displays are now industrially glued into their metal housing, almost all I/O is soldered to the logic board requiring a full replacement to fix, good luck if you're out of warranty. In exchange for the faulty part back, Apple will offer an authorized provider about 20-30% discount on the part which they call an "Exchange Price". Nothing hurt my soul more then to have to quote customers $700-900 AUD (exchange price) to fix a simple backlight malfunction. Interestingly the price of replacing a Display or a Logic Board through Apple's 'Exchange' program is the same cost price for a Service Provider and these are the most costly parts of a Mac. They do not offer exchange prices to these independent providers and the 'stock' price of Apple's service parts are astronomical. I highly doubt that any independent repairer has ever ordered any part from Apple. Maybe they ordered tools, Apple does have some decent tools.
trifurcate 3y ago
> I'm not very interested in this "right to repair" stuff - it revolves around demanding modular parts for quick and easy replacement. People who are actually close to the metal, who actually get their hands dirty are repairing those devices since ever. It also involves demanding access to proprietary ICs and information like schematics. A component level repair might become impossible if you don't have access to a vendor-specific replacement for some burnt battery charging IC. You can't really fix up a silicon die like you can a dead pixel.
voidwtf 3y ago
"Right to repair" isn't all about demanding modular parts, in most cases right-to-repair proponents aren't even asking the manufacturer to sell them parts. Right-to-repair advocates want the "option" to repair their own device at the very least. Manufacturers of devices are starting to intentionally brick devices when the replaced parts have not been specifically paired with the device. They're using the smokescreen of "security" to justify this, but with no options to accept the security implications. Imagine replacing a windshield in your car, and the car refuses to let you turn on the windshield wipers until you activate the windshield with the manufacturer. The manufacturer will not activate 3rd party windshields. Or imagine replacing the seatbelt spool/cartridge in your car, and the car refuses to stop dinging because the part has not been activated by the manufacturer. This is what manufacturers are slowly doing to all devices and parts. Between excuses of security and wanting to control the user experience, it's all anti-consumer BS.
- mrtksn 3y ago
  Right, that trend is worrying. Yet, everything is still made of atoms. The people who complain about, Coded parts are people who don’t actually do any repairs. They just swap parts and they are having the issue of parts refusing to work. Instead of replacing modules, you can repair parts. Beneath the abstractions, everything is very simple and obeys the laws of physics. You can’t actually encrypt glass, what’s manufacturers can do is just putting some chip to the components.
  - seec 3y ago
    That's nonsense. There are many parts that often end up in a state where they are effectively unrepairable. And even if they were, it more often than not makes no sense to repair them manually when they are machines that churn dozens of them per second for unbelievably cheap. You just need access to them. How would you repair a fried IC on a mobo if you don't have access to the said? You plan on doing atomic level repair on a 10c parts? If you get a speaker assembly, destroyed by water, pressure or whatever: do you swap the 30c, 20mm part with a new one or spend hours disassembling the thing by hand? Once I spent hours repairing a touch ID button. I had to micro solder the encryption chip with fly wire (finer than a hair) from the old broken button to the new one. All this is essentially because Apple is incompetent enough to design stuff in a better way and wants to prevent people doing it. All this so they can sell a new phone because the price they are going to quote for this repair will make no sense to the user. I want to say there surely are better ways than this, but it is an understatement. You can say whatever you want but this needs fixing, and it does not happen without strong political support and new laws... The way companies can prevent people getting their stuff fixed cheaper because of artificial limitation is ridiculous. And Apple is leading the way with this.