3 ms·

When you lump all legislation, government initiatives, reforms, taxes, etc together and say "this is a cohesive, person-like entity I can reason about" you will

When you lump all legislation, government initiatives, reforms, taxes, etc together and say "this is a cohesive, person-like entity I can reason about" you will definitely find contradictions everywhere. Just within a business or bar or family, dissenting opinions are everywhere. Unlike a business, every little opinion and workgroup and project are a matter of public record and are aimed at affecting public policy. So yeah, it sure seems like "They" are a bunch of hypocrites. And if you want to go further and lump _all pollsters_ into the group of like-minded, coherent entities that never dissent from eachother ... well, why stop there? Why not the "other party" as well? Or reptile people?

NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago
> When you lump all legislation, government initiatives, reforms, taxes, etc together and say "this is a cohesive, person-like entity I can reason about" But it is actually a person-like entity. It is a weak hivemind composed of humans who have (for the most part) had their own individualistic tendencies suppressed or even eliminated. It's the most human-like non-human you'll ever see. It's not unfair to think of it as person-like. It's not unreasonable to think of it as person-like. It is, in many cases, dangerous to think of it in any other way. But, there are people out there who find it inconvenient to their political ambitions if you think this way (or, really, there are politics-entities out there for whom it is inconvenient and who dangle their semi-individual chelicerae out to belittle and chastise you for it). > Or reptile people? Reptile people would be a relief. They just want to eat babies and impersonate the queen or something.
zosima 3y ago
> Just within a business or bar or family, dissenting opinions are everywhere. Unlike a business, every little opinion and workgroup and project are a matter of public record and are aimed at affecting public policy. So yeah, it sure seems like "They" are a bunch of hypocrites. This is simply not true. See e.g. here, how the commission does not publish dissenting internal comments in the official meeting minutes: https://www.ftm.eu/articles/controversy-between-european-commissioners-stays-secret-in-special-minutes-for-thirty-years https://www.ftm.eu/articles/controversy-between-european-com...
- jvanderbot 3y ago
  OK, so everything I said was true except > matter of public record referring to > every little opinion and workgroup? I think we're discounting inches. Perhaps not public record always in all countries, but my broad strokes comment stands.
  - zosima 3y ago
    This is the damn minutes from the commission meetings, which are being censored, not every little workgroup. And furthermore, this is not common knowledge. Most people are lead to think that the commission publishes full minutes from their meetings. I can assure you that the censoring goes much deeper than this. EU and especially the commission are not being open, while working hard to create the impression that they are.

NoMoreNicksLeft 3y ago

> When you lump all legislation, government initiatives, reforms, taxes, etc together and say "this is a cohesive, person-like entity I can reason about" But it is actually a person-like entity. It is a weak hivemind composed of humans who have (for the most part) had their own individualistic tendencies suppressed or even eliminated. It's the most human-like non-human you'll ever see. It's not unfair to think of it as person-like. It's not unreasonable to think of it as person-like. It is, in many cases, dangerous to think of it in any other way. But, there are people out there who find it inconvenient to their political ambitions if you think this way (or, really, there are politics-entities out there for whom it is inconvenient and who dangle their semi-individual chelicerae out to belittle and chastise you for it). > Or reptile people? Reptile people would be a relief. They just want to eat babies and impersonate the queen or something.

zosima 3y ago

> Just within a business or bar or family, dissenting opinions are everywhere. Unlike a business, every little opinion and workgroup and project are a matter of public record and are aimed at affecting public policy. So yeah, it sure seems like "They" are a bunch of hypocrites. This is simply not true. See e.g. here, how the commission does not publish dissenting internal comments in the official meeting minutes: https://www.ftm.eu/articles/controversy-between-european-commissioners-stays-secret-in-special-minutes-for-thirty-years https://www.ftm.eu/articles/controversy-between-european-com...

jvanderbot 3y ago
OK, so everything I said was true except > matter of public record referring to > every little opinion and workgroup? I think we're discounting inches. Perhaps not public record always in all countries, but my broad strokes comment stands.
- zosima 3y ago
  This is the damn minutes from the commission meetings, which are being censored, not every little workgroup. And furthermore, this is not common knowledge. Most people are lead to think that the commission publishes full minutes from their meetings. I can assure you that the censoring goes much deeper than this. EU and especially the commission are not being open, while working hard to create the impression that they are.