6 ms·

Very encouraging progress. Will be interesting to see whether the anti-covid vaccine crowd will keep the same resentments against cancer vaccines.

by jcfrei 3y ago

throwaway-blaze 3y ago
I think they will come to the conclusion that the benefits of the therapy outweigh the possible risks in this case, in a way they did not for the covid vax.
- Teever 3y ago
  Some of them will. Some of them will not. https://theprovince.com/news/sheila-annette-lewis-alberta-covid-organ-transplant/wcm/094d3161-34d2-41cb-b2ca-edd2f5a0ca44 https://theprovince.com/news/sheila-annette-lewis-alberta-co...
- Netcob 3y ago
  There's a significant amount of people who take the same approach to cancer as they do to diseases such as covid, such as: * Pray * Fast * Take some essential oils / sugar pills * Eat way too much vitamin C * Protest against nearby 5G towers * Take a lot of niacin and figure out what you did wrong in this or a past life while going on a former cruise ship that is filled with asbestos
  - doener 3y ago
    Fasting actually could help: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9530862/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9530862/
  - theultdev 3y ago
    Is that "significant amount of people" based on something or just your own prejudices? Personally most people I know who don't want the covid vax reached that conclusion after weighing the risk/benefit. I'm also from an area where "Pray" would be a significant part of their life, but has nothing to do with their decision.
    - Lord-Jobo 3y ago
      >Personally most people I know who don't want the covid vax reached that conclusion after weighing the risk/benefit This has to be a class/geographic thing because all but one of the 2 dozen or so people I have met that told me they didnt get the covid vax(rural area, southern state), said they did so for reasons that revolved loosely around " i dont want the demon-crat drug changing my DNA and causing a WHO mass population culling". You could definitely claim that only those types of people are the ones being vocal about it, but the actual demographic breakdown of opinion on the covid vaccine.... https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://arc-anglerfish-washpost-prod-washpost.s3.amazonaws.com/public/TSM66IAQX5DH3G2JXIVACUI5UE.png&w=1200 https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://... only 40% of Republicans view the covid vaccine as safe, as of sept. 23. last month. they STILL dont think its safe. compared to 80% for democrats, a lot of that likely to due any loading of the word "safe".
      - theultdev 3y ago
        My anecdotes of people's reasons disagree with yours so I don't think they are very useful. A political breakdown doesn't give you the insight of those people's individual reasoning.
  - EdSharkey 3y ago
    Pro-vaxxx team-sport zealots like this guy only inflame vaccine hesitancy in otherwise reasonable people. Stop scaring people off with your othering, jerkface attitude. History will be the judge as to whether you are right about a particular vaccine. They're not all the same in terms of efficacy nor safety, OBVIOUSLY.
dimitrios1 3y ago
One thing to keep in mind is a lot of the anti-covid vaccine crowd was not anti vax in general -- just anti covid vaccine.
- lawlessone 3y ago
  A lot of them didn't know themselves what they are, no clear idea what they were against. Their biggest talking point was the vaccine would rare cause heart inflammation. Covid also caused heart inflammation much more often and more worse. It's like people arguing against airbags. Edit: incidentally there's a whole other thread on this just seen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37999349 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37999349
  - geysersam 3y ago
    I'm vaccinated and all. However, it's impossible to prove that Covid is more harmful than the vaccine in every particular cohort of a population. Anti vaxxers perceive themselves to belong to a cohort that are less likely to be harmed by the illness, because of youth, behaviour, or physical fitness or luck or religion or whatever. On the other hand, they have plenty of evidence that people belonging to the same cohort have been adversely affected by the vaccine, therefore it's entirely logical from their point of view to not get vaccinated.
    - peter422 3y ago
      If that is the standard then I’d say it’s probably impossible to prove anything. I think it’s extremely easy to prove that a covid infection is more harmful than the vaccine in aggregate in every demagogic. Honestly that is probably the case even if you are only counting post-covid symptoms [1]. 1: https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/antimicrobial-stewardship-and-healthcare-epidemiology/article/effectiveness-of-covid19-vaccine-in-the-prevention-of-postcovid-conditions-a-systematic-literature-review-and-metaanalysis-of-the-latest-research/A0B115B5D3AA60846799857B801D116E https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/antimicrobial-stewar...
      - 3y ago
cmrdporcupine 3y ago
It's very hard to say, but IMHO the best thing that governments and public health officials could have done (and could do) with this whole scenario is just ... lay off ... on these people once the majority were vaccinated and Omicron came on the scene and the vaccines were shown not to be "sterilizing" against it. Putting pressure on past Jan 2022 or so simply became counterproductive. To be clear: I think the vax skeptics/opponents were wrong. I've had every one of them I could get as have my kids. And I've still not caught COVID, over 3 years on (or if I did it was so mild as to be undetectable.) I think the vaccines are great. But these people have been backed into an ideological corner, and they're behaving like anybody when they're cornered. It is now best to back away, because we are now dealing with another kind of contagion because many anti-vaxxers became ripe pickings for formerly unrelated far right, conspiracy type radicalization. I think there are many lessons for public health officials here for future campaigns.
- Lord-Jobo 3y ago
  There was basically nothing any public official in the US could do to steer the ship in any kind of direction, once the political leader of 75 million Americans had hijacked the entire disease, public health measures to address it, and medical treatments of it, for some pretty over the top and insane political pivoting. The timeline really highlights the volume of avenues he took that damaged the public health apparatus around COVID. https://www.factcheck.org/2020/10/timeline-of-trumps-covid-19-comments/ https://www.factcheck.org/2020/10/timeline-of-trumps-covid-1... its no big deal, itll go away soon, i took hydroxychloroquine, masks dont work, "If we didn’t do testing, we’d have no cases", stop shutting down, kids with the sniffles are classified as COVID, and a near constant name drop and slamming of Fauci. The guy undermined HIS OWN public health officials constantly and turned them into conspiracy scapegoats. The battle was lost well before the vaccine was even released. What did he think his supporters would do when Fauci came out and said "take this vaccine"? Hell, Trump has been supporting the vaccine for at least 2 years now, and even he cant fix the mess he made.
  - cmrdporcupine 3y ago
    Yeah I mean, I'll take your word for it, I guess.,..But I live in another country... and we did not have Trump... but the same crazy people emerged. It's possible Trump influenced what happened here, but I suspect this is at least a bit of Americo-centrism on your part...

Very encouraging progress. Will be interesting to see whether the anti-covid vaccine crowd will keep the same resentments against cancer vaccines.

by jcfrei 3y ago

Very encouraging progress. Will be interesting to see whether the anti-covid vaccine crowd will keep the same resentments against cancer vaccines.

throwaway-blaze 3y ago

I think they will come to the conclusion that the benefits of the therapy outweigh the possible risks in this case, in a way they did not for the covid vax.

Teever 3y ago
Some of them will. Some of them will not. https://theprovince.com/news/sheila-annette-lewis-alberta-covid-organ-transplant/wcm/094d3161-34d2-41cb-b2ca-edd2f5a0ca44 https://theprovince.com/news/sheila-annette-lewis-alberta-co...
Netcob 3y ago
There's a significant amount of people who take the same approach to cancer as they do to diseases such as covid, such as: * Pray * Fast * Take some essential oils / sugar pills * Eat way too much vitamin C * Protest against nearby 5G towers * Take a lot of niacin and figure out what you did wrong in this or a past life while going on a former cruise ship that is filled with asbestos
- doener 3y ago
  Fasting actually could help: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9530862/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9530862/
- theultdev 3y ago
  Is that "significant amount of people" based on something or just your own prejudices? Personally most people I know who don't want the covid vax reached that conclusion after weighing the risk/benefit. I'm also from an area where "Pray" would be a significant part of their life, but has nothing to do with their decision.
  - Lord-Jobo 3y ago
    >Personally most people I know who don't want the covid vax reached that conclusion after weighing the risk/benefit This has to be a class/geographic thing because all but one of the 2 dozen or so people I have met that told me they didnt get the covid vax(rural area, southern state), said they did so for reasons that revolved loosely around " i dont want the demon-crat drug changing my DNA and causing a WHO mass population culling". You could definitely claim that only those types of people are the ones being vocal about it, but the actual demographic breakdown of opinion on the covid vaccine.... https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://arc-anglerfish-washpost-prod-washpost.s3.amazonaws.com/public/TSM66IAQX5DH3G2JXIVACUI5UE.png&w=1200 https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://... only 40% of Republicans view the covid vaccine as safe, as of sept. 23. last month. they STILL dont think its safe. compared to 80% for democrats, a lot of that likely to due any loading of the word "safe".
    - theultdev 3y ago
      My anecdotes of people's reasons disagree with yours so I don't think they are very useful. A political breakdown doesn't give you the insight of those people's individual reasoning.
- EdSharkey 3y ago
  Pro-vaxxx team-sport zealots like this guy only inflame vaccine hesitancy in otherwise reasonable people. Stop scaring people off with your othering, jerkface attitude. History will be the judge as to whether you are right about a particular vaccine. They're not all the same in terms of efficacy nor safety, OBVIOUSLY.

dimitrios1 3y ago

One thing to keep in mind is a lot of the anti-covid vaccine crowd was not anti vax in general -- just anti covid vaccine.

lawlessone 3y ago
A lot of them didn't know themselves what they are, no clear idea what they were against. Their biggest talking point was the vaccine would rare cause heart inflammation. Covid also caused heart inflammation much more often and more worse. It's like people arguing against airbags. Edit: incidentally there's a whole other thread on this just seen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37999349 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37999349
- geysersam 3y ago
  I'm vaccinated and all. However, it's impossible to prove that Covid is more harmful than the vaccine in every particular cohort of a population. Anti vaxxers perceive themselves to belong to a cohort that are less likely to be harmed by the illness, because of youth, behaviour, or physical fitness or luck or religion or whatever. On the other hand, they have plenty of evidence that people belonging to the same cohort have been adversely affected by the vaccine, therefore it's entirely logical from their point of view to not get vaccinated.
  - peter422 3y ago
    If that is the standard then I’d say it’s probably impossible to prove anything. I think it’s extremely easy to prove that a covid infection is more harmful than the vaccine in aggregate in every demagogic. Honestly that is probably the case even if you are only counting post-covid symptoms [1]. 1: https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/antimicrobial-stewardship-and-healthcare-epidemiology/article/effectiveness-of-covid19-vaccine-in-the-prevention-of-postcovid-conditions-a-systematic-literature-review-and-metaanalysis-of-the-latest-research/A0B115B5D3AA60846799857B801D116E https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/antimicrobial-stewar...
    - 3y ago

cmrdporcupine 3y ago

It's very hard to say, but IMHO the best thing that governments and public health officials could have done (and could do) with this whole scenario is just ... lay off ... on these people once the majority were vaccinated and Omicron came on the scene and the vaccines were shown not to be "sterilizing" against it. Putting pressure on past Jan 2022 or so simply became counterproductive. To be clear: I think the vax skeptics/opponents were wrong. I've had every one of them I could get as have my kids. And I've still not caught COVID, over 3 years on (or if I did it was so mild as to be undetectable.) I think the vaccines are great. But these people have been backed into an ideological corner, and they're behaving like anybody when they're cornered. It is now best to back away, because we are now dealing with another kind of contagion because many anti-vaxxers became ripe pickings for formerly unrelated far right, conspiracy type radicalization. I think there are many lessons for public health officials here for future campaigns.

Lord-Jobo 3y ago
There was basically nothing any public official in the US could do to steer the ship in any kind of direction, once the political leader of 75 million Americans had hijacked the entire disease, public health measures to address it, and medical treatments of it, for some pretty over the top and insane political pivoting. The timeline really highlights the volume of avenues he took that damaged the public health apparatus around COVID. https://www.factcheck.org/2020/10/timeline-of-trumps-covid-19-comments/ https://www.factcheck.org/2020/10/timeline-of-trumps-covid-1... its no big deal, itll go away soon, i took hydroxychloroquine, masks dont work, "If we didn’t do testing, we’d have no cases", stop shutting down, kids with the sniffles are classified as COVID, and a near constant name drop and slamming of Fauci. The guy undermined HIS OWN public health officials constantly and turned them into conspiracy scapegoats. The battle was lost well before the vaccine was even released. What did he think his supporters would do when Fauci came out and said "take this vaccine"? Hell, Trump has been supporting the vaccine for at least 2 years now, and even he cant fix the mess he made.
- cmrdporcupine 3y ago
  Yeah I mean, I'll take your word for it, I guess.,..But I live in another country... and we did not have Trump... but the same crazy people emerged. It's possible Trump influenced what happened here, but I suspect this is at least a bit of Americo-centrism on your part...