4 ms·

You are assuming that you know better than the experts who design and decide what clothes to sell. Those experts are sometimes wrong, yes, but not that often, y

You are assuming that you know better than the experts who design and decide what clothes to sell. Those experts are sometimes wrong, yes, but not that often, you need really good arguments to convince us that you know better than them.

arghwhat 3y ago
If everyone needs jeans, and everyone makes jeans with small pockets, everyone will buy jeans with small pockets and make the analytics show that the market is satisfied and profit targets are met. These "experts" only maximize for their own preferred design and target profits. The fact that womens pockets are ridiculously small has become a meme is a good indication that they are wrong and do not care. Ask any seamstress and they will agree.
- Jensson 3y ago
  > The fact that womens pockets are ridiculously small has become a meme is a good indication that they are wrong and do not care. This isn't true, it can be a meme anyway if women prefer the looks of small pockets they wont even consider the larger pocketed one, and we end up in the current situation. It isn't hard to find clothes with larger pockets, it is hard to find clothes women like with larger pockets.
  - hef19898 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - Jensson 3y ago
      Obviously, otherwise you wouldn't look at a thread about women's fashion on a start up tech forum. Everyone here clicked it since they want to see what start up tech people think about women's fashion.
  - arghwhat 3y ago
    Yeah, but I as a man do not need to wear cargo pants to fit a phone in my pocket. If you can get skinny jeans with room for a phone for men, you should be able to get skinny jeans with room for a phone for women.
- lotsofpulp 3y ago
  Surely, if seamstresses agree, then selling women’s clothes with bigger/more pockets is not a novel idea. And making clothes with bigger/more pockets does not require a high barrier to entry, the technology has been there for decades. And profit margins on clothes are tiny, so it stands to reason that sellers would be looking for any edge they can get to sell more clothes and/or at a higher price. If you agree with the above, then there are two options: 1) for decades, people whose livelihood is selling clothes have missed an obvious opportunity to earn more money 2) people whose livelihood is selling clothes have not been able to succeed in selling women’s clothes with bigger/more pockets If option 1, then someone needs to jump into this business. I sympathize with my wife and daughter who also complain about the lack and size of pockets, but I am not sure how to square that with the above parameters. Maybe it is an under-explored business opportunity, but it is so low barrier to entry that it seems unbelievable that the answer is not sufficient lack of demand (option 2).
  - arghwhat 3y ago
    Asked a close friend of mine who is a female seamstress. Their opinion on the matter: 1. The popular brands are run by men who do not understand and/or agree with the issue. 2. The large manufacturers as they have favorable supply deals, and threaten suppliers to not sell to competitors at the risk of losing their business, resulting in lack of affordable materials to build competing businesses. The former being the reason for the current bias in options, and the latter explaining why there is no fair market for alternative options.
    - lotsofpulp 3y ago
      I find that hard to believe. Chairman at Zara is a woman, CEO of gap was a woman for at least 2020 to 2022, CEO of H&M is a woman. > 1. The popular brands are run by men who do not understand and/or agree with the issue. What is there to understand? Bigger pockets fit more things. It is physics. It is possible, but I doubt a man leading a clothing company is deciding against making more money by selling clothes with bigger pockets due to a philosophy of believing women’s clothes should not have pockets. Given the option of earning more money or preventing women from having more or bigger pockets, surely every single leader in the clothing business is not going to forego more money.
empyrrhicist 3y ago
Lol, you're trying to mansplain pockets. Literally every time this has come up in conversation I've heard women complain that there aren't any options.
- Jensson 3y ago
  You don't understand, they want to both eat their cake and keep it. They want large pockets, but they also refuse to wear clothes they find ugly, and they find large pockets ugly, hence they wont find any clothes with large pockets since they filter them out before even considering it. But of course if you ask them if they magically want larger pockets they say yes. I'd also want magical pants.
- lesuorac 3y ago
  > Literally every time this has come up in conversation I've heard women complain that there aren't any options. I've looked nowhere and I can't find it! Literally every few years some company comes out claiming they'll make woman's pants with pockets.
  - empyrrhicist 3y ago
    [Citation needed] I bought a phone without a 3.5mm jack once because I didn't think to check. I may have to buy one again when my Pixel dies due to lack of options. Clearly I don't care about 3.5mm jacks /s
    - lesuorac 3y ago
      > [Citation needed] Sure, try to buy anything from Pairess (2019) [1]. It turns out functional woman's clothes isn't a good enough business to last 4 years. [1]: https://www.affirm.com/business/blog/affirm-pairess-disrupt-fashion https://www.affirm.com/business/blog/affirm-pairess-disrupt-...
    - lotsofpulp 3y ago
      Advanced electronics have a very high barrier to entry, and are unsuitable as an analogy to the clothing business.
nordsieck 3y ago
Also, small creators enter the market all the time. If some indie brand was seeing huge demand selling women's clothes with large pockets, the mainstream brands would hop on the bandwagon in a heartbeat.
- nerdponx 3y ago
  Where do I find small creators making pants? Serious question. Neither my wife nor I can find pants we like.
  - lotsofpulp 3y ago
    I know you can go to India and pick out fabrics and have them make custom clothing, but you might be able to find someone online these days. For example, I searched “custom clothing india” and came up with these: https://www.eshakti.com/default.aspx https://www.eshakti.com/default.aspx https://www.cloudtailor.com/ https://www.cloudtailor.com/
- empyrrhicist 3y ago
  People like to try on pants, and people who just want normal pants with functional pockets are the LAST people you'd expect to be looking through niche clothing boutiques lol. Not to mention custom clothes are super expensive.
  - Elvie 3y ago
    Exactly, I want a pair of functional jeans, not too skinny, not stupid flared with handy pockets for phone, keys, wallet I do not want to go rummaging on niche shops or to buy online and have the faff of returning things that don't fit
    - empyrrhicist 3y ago
      Clearly you don't actually exist, or you're lying to yourself about your preferences /s

arghwhat 3y ago

If everyone needs jeans, and everyone makes jeans with small pockets, everyone will buy jeans with small pockets and make the analytics show that the market is satisfied and profit targets are met. These "experts" only maximize for their own preferred design and target profits. The fact that womens pockets are ridiculously small has become a meme is a good indication that they are wrong and do not care. Ask any seamstress and they will agree.

Jensson 3y ago
> The fact that womens pockets are ridiculously small has become a meme is a good indication that they are wrong and do not care. This isn't true, it can be a meme anyway if women prefer the looks of small pockets they wont even consider the larger pocketed one, and we end up in the current situation. It isn't hard to find clothes with larger pockets, it is hard to find clothes women like with larger pockets.
- hef19898 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - Jensson 3y ago
    Obviously, otherwise you wouldn't look at a thread about women's fashion on a start up tech forum. Everyone here clicked it since they want to see what start up tech people think about women's fashion.
- arghwhat 3y ago
  Yeah, but I as a man do not need to wear cargo pants to fit a phone in my pocket. If you can get skinny jeans with room for a phone for men, you should be able to get skinny jeans with room for a phone for women.
lotsofpulp 3y ago
Surely, if seamstresses agree, then selling women’s clothes with bigger/more pockets is not a novel idea. And making clothes with bigger/more pockets does not require a high barrier to entry, the technology has been there for decades. And profit margins on clothes are tiny, so it stands to reason that sellers would be looking for any edge they can get to sell more clothes and/or at a higher price. If you agree with the above, then there are two options: 1) for decades, people whose livelihood is selling clothes have missed an obvious opportunity to earn more money 2) people whose livelihood is selling clothes have not been able to succeed in selling women’s clothes with bigger/more pockets If option 1, then someone needs to jump into this business. I sympathize with my wife and daughter who also complain about the lack and size of pockets, but I am not sure how to square that with the above parameters. Maybe it is an under-explored business opportunity, but it is so low barrier to entry that it seems unbelievable that the answer is not sufficient lack of demand (option 2).
- arghwhat 3y ago
  Asked a close friend of mine who is a female seamstress. Their opinion on the matter: 1. The popular brands are run by men who do not understand and/or agree with the issue. 2. The large manufacturers as they have favorable supply deals, and threaten suppliers to not sell to competitors at the risk of losing their business, resulting in lack of affordable materials to build competing businesses. The former being the reason for the current bias in options, and the latter explaining why there is no fair market for alternative options.
  - lotsofpulp 3y ago
    I find that hard to believe. Chairman at Zara is a woman, CEO of gap was a woman for at least 2020 to 2022, CEO of H&M is a woman. > 1. The popular brands are run by men who do not understand and/or agree with the issue. What is there to understand? Bigger pockets fit more things. It is physics. It is possible, but I doubt a man leading a clothing company is deciding against making more money by selling clothes with bigger pockets due to a philosophy of believing women’s clothes should not have pockets. Given the option of earning more money or preventing women from having more or bigger pockets, surely every single leader in the clothing business is not going to forego more money.

empyrrhicist 3y ago

Lol, you're trying to mansplain pockets. Literally every time this has come up in conversation I've heard women complain that there aren't any options.

Jensson 3y ago
You don't understand, they want to both eat their cake and keep it. They want large pockets, but they also refuse to wear clothes they find ugly, and they find large pockets ugly, hence they wont find any clothes with large pockets since they filter them out before even considering it. But of course if you ask them if they magically want larger pockets they say yes. I'd also want magical pants.
lesuorac 3y ago
> Literally every time this has come up in conversation I've heard women complain that there aren't any options. I've looked nowhere and I can't find it! Literally every few years some company comes out claiming they'll make woman's pants with pockets.
- empyrrhicist 3y ago
  [Citation needed] I bought a phone without a 3.5mm jack once because I didn't think to check. I may have to buy one again when my Pixel dies due to lack of options. Clearly I don't care about 3.5mm jacks /s
  - lesuorac 3y ago
    > [Citation needed] Sure, try to buy anything from Pairess (2019) [1]. It turns out functional woman's clothes isn't a good enough business to last 4 years. [1]: https://www.affirm.com/business/blog/affirm-pairess-disrupt-fashion https://www.affirm.com/business/blog/affirm-pairess-disrupt-...
  - lotsofpulp 3y ago
    Advanced electronics have a very high barrier to entry, and are unsuitable as an analogy to the clothing business.

nordsieck 3y ago

Also, small creators enter the market all the time. If some indie brand was seeing huge demand selling women's clothes with large pockets, the mainstream brands would hop on the bandwagon in a heartbeat.

nerdponx 3y ago
Where do I find small creators making pants? Serious question. Neither my wife nor I can find pants we like.
- lotsofpulp 3y ago
  I know you can go to India and pick out fabrics and have them make custom clothing, but you might be able to find someone online these days. For example, I searched “custom clothing india” and came up with these: https://www.eshakti.com/default.aspx https://www.eshakti.com/default.aspx https://www.cloudtailor.com/ https://www.cloudtailor.com/
empyrrhicist 3y ago
People like to try on pants, and people who just want normal pants with functional pockets are the LAST people you'd expect to be looking through niche clothing boutiques lol. Not to mention custom clothes are super expensive.
- Elvie 3y ago
  Exactly, I want a pair of functional jeans, not too skinny, not stupid flared with handy pockets for phone, keys, wallet I do not want to go rummaging on niche shops or to buy online and have the faff of returning things that don't fit
  - empyrrhicist 3y ago
    Clearly you don't actually exist, or you're lying to yourself about your preferences /s