4 ms·

This is essentially a medical device for administering behavioral therapy to treat social anxiety, and I don't see any indication that it was developed with any

This is essentially a medical device for administering behavioral therapy to treat social anxiety, and I don't see any indication that it was developed with any kind of input or review from experts in the field. I honestly feel that borders on irresponsible. A review from a psychologist specializing in social anxiety would be a good idea.

deltoids 3y ago
TLDR; creator should get a psychologist behind this project to avoid negative views. Disclaimer: I do not mean to belittle the author of the comment above in any way. I'm sharing my views on why I find it absurd to call a mental health tool like this irresponsible without a greenlight from a psychologist. I don't understand how people find these things so irresponsible. It's the same with using an LLM for therapy. Many therapists are furious with that, regardless of how effective it has been for many people. In the same way, the author of the comment above seem to find it irresponsible for the creator of this app to share this tool without having it greenlighted by a psychologist (the establishment). This is despite the fact that the creator has had amazing outcomes with his newfound method of dealing with social anxiety and is now sharing it with the world. In my view, his experience speaks for itself and it is up to users whether they want to trust his words and try it out. There's a clear tendency to demonize anything that contradicts or hasn't been greenlighted by the establishment. If you follow this logic to the extreme, we cannot as human beings share recommendations to others based on our own experiences when it comes to mental health. As absurd as that it, it's probably best for the creator of this app to get a psychologist behind it to avoid this negative discourse.
- rocketbop 3y ago
  > It's the same with using an LLM for therapy. Many therapists are furious with that, regardless of how effective it has been for many people. I doubt therapists would get furious at people getting better, regardless of the mechanism, in the same way that doctors wouldn't be furious about a weird trick to cure rheumatism, the common cold, or any other malady.
- ksenzee 3y ago
  I understand this point of view - why shouldn't people share things that have helped them? - but that's why we regulate things like cures for diseases. Taken to an extreme, "here's what helped me" leads to cancer "cures" being hawked all over the internet. To me this app falls somewhere in between "here's how I quit procrastinating" and "here's how I cured my skin cancer." I can say from experience that social anxiety is not always easily treatable, even by your average therapist, and specialists in it have valuable knowledge that I think it would be wise to take advantage of if you're publicizing a treatment.
- tolarewaju3 3y ago
  Thanks! And yes, I know I'll have to strike a balance between "here's what helped me" and disclaimers. But this essentially expresses my views. I do understand that there are things I'll need to do to put people's minds at ease and like the author of the comment said, avoid negative discourse.
Cthulhu_ 3y ago
I don't see the issue personally. You don't need to be a psychologist to set people small achieveable goals and gamify them. That said, people that reach for this app should probably see a psychologist / psychotherapist first and foremost; while self-diagnosis is valid to a point and apps (or self-help books for that matter) may help and provide comfort, there may be more to one's mental health issues that an app won't fix.
- soco 3y ago
  The small goal setting is the happy path of its usage. As you rightfully notice, those actually in need of such app should seek real treatments and gamification could be part of them - if and only if those doctors recommend it. Otherwise I can imagine the app also building (untreated) frustration if some goals are not correct for whatever reason, and also frustration because some would think they get real treatment while they're not. Just guessing as I'm not a psychologist.

deltoids 3y ago

TLDR; creator should get a psychologist behind this project to avoid negative views. Disclaimer: I do not mean to belittle the author of the comment above in any way. I'm sharing my views on why I find it absurd to call a mental health tool like this irresponsible without a greenlight from a psychologist. I don't understand how people find these things so irresponsible. It's the same with using an LLM for therapy. Many therapists are furious with that, regardless of how effective it has been for many people. In the same way, the author of the comment above seem to find it irresponsible for the creator of this app to share this tool without having it greenlighted by a psychologist (the establishment). This is despite the fact that the creator has had amazing outcomes with his newfound method of dealing with social anxiety and is now sharing it with the world. In my view, his experience speaks for itself and it is up to users whether they want to trust his words and try it out. There's a clear tendency to demonize anything that contradicts or hasn't been greenlighted by the establishment. If you follow this logic to the extreme, we cannot as human beings share recommendations to others based on our own experiences when it comes to mental health. As absurd as that it, it's probably best for the creator of this app to get a psychologist behind it to avoid this negative discourse.

rocketbop 3y ago
> It's the same with using an LLM for therapy. Many therapists are furious with that, regardless of how effective it has been for many people. I doubt therapists would get furious at people getting better, regardless of the mechanism, in the same way that doctors wouldn't be furious about a weird trick to cure rheumatism, the common cold, or any other malady.
ksenzee 3y ago
I understand this point of view - why shouldn't people share things that have helped them? - but that's why we regulate things like cures for diseases. Taken to an extreme, "here's what helped me" leads to cancer "cures" being hawked all over the internet. To me this app falls somewhere in between "here's how I quit procrastinating" and "here's how I cured my skin cancer." I can say from experience that social anxiety is not always easily treatable, even by your average therapist, and specialists in it have valuable knowledge that I think it would be wise to take advantage of if you're publicizing a treatment.
tolarewaju3 3y ago
Thanks! And yes, I know I'll have to strike a balance between "here's what helped me" and disclaimers. But this essentially expresses my views. I do understand that there are things I'll need to do to put people's minds at ease and like the author of the comment said, avoid negative discourse.

Cthulhu_ 3y ago

I don't see the issue personally. You don't need to be a psychologist to set people small achieveable goals and gamify them. That said, people that reach for this app should probably see a psychologist / psychotherapist first and foremost; while self-diagnosis is valid to a point and apps (or self-help books for that matter) may help and provide comfort, there may be more to one's mental health issues that an app won't fix.

soco 3y ago
The small goal setting is the happy path of its usage. As you rightfully notice, those actually in need of such app should seek real treatments and gamification could be part of them - if and only if those doctors recommend it. Otherwise I can imagine the app also building (untreated) frustration if some goals are not correct for whatever reason, and also frustration because some would think they get real treatment while they're not. Just guessing as I'm not a psychologist.