3 ms·

If only there were a decentralized method of electronic payment that single entities could not control.

naasking 3y ago
There probably isn't. You'll see a crackdown on cryptocurrencies soon enough, particularly for energy use. That's already begun.
- rvz 3y ago
  > There probably isn't. Please stop being obtuse. You know there is and there are lots of these cryptocurrencies / blockchains that these people turn to due to the problems above. > You'll see a crackdown on cryptocurrencies soon enough, particularly for energy use. Ethereum 'cracked down' on its energy usage all the way down to 99.99% [0] when it switched from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake. [0] https://consensys.io/blog/ethereum-blockchain-eliminates-99-99-of-its-carbon-footprint-overnight-after-a-successful-merge-according-to-new-report https://consensys.io/blog/ethereum-blockchain-eliminates-99-...
  - naasking 3y ago
    You're being obtuse if you think the status quo will be tolerated indefinitely. Not all goods are available via crypto, which means exchanges to and from real currencies are failure points that undermine claims to decentralization. > Ethereum 'cracked down' on its energy usage all the way down to 99.99% [0] when it switched from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake. I was referring to China's crackdown on Bitcoin. Proof-of-stake is no longer fully decentralized, and so vulnerable so sufficiently powerful actors.
    - morkalork 3y ago
      As unlikely as it is, digital payments being regulated as a utility is far more likely than a scenario where entire countries currencies are subverted en mass. Util I can be paid, pay taxes and do everything else, it's a non-solution.
    - rvz 3y ago
      > You're being obtuse if you think the status quo will be tolerated indefinitely. Strawman much? Did I mention that it will be tolerated indefinitely? In fact, I agree that regulations are coming for crypto since it cannot be completely and totally 100% stopped, like it or not. Both will co-exist. > I was referring to China's crackdown on Bitcoin. You didn't mention Bitcoin anywhere in your comment and suggested that a general crackdown on all cryptocurrencies will happen based on their energy usage. Even so in regards to the Bitcoin, what 'crackdown' exactly? [0] [1] [2] > Proof-of-stake is no longer fully decentralized, and so vulnerable so sufficiently powerful actors. Theoretically, but is that why we are still waiting for such powerful actors to fully take over the Ethereum network over its infinitesimal energy usage? [0] https://archive.ph/700H0 https://archive.ph/700H0 [1] https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/2022/bitcoin-mining-new-data-reveal-a-surprising-resurgence/ https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/2022/bitcoin-mining-new-data-revea... [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/18/chinas-underground-bitcoin-miners-.html?utm_term=Autofeed https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/18/chinas-underground-bitcoin-m...
- Ridj48dhsnsh 3y ago
  I agree that the crackdown will continue, but I'm fairly sure cryptocurrencies will survive in a non-trivial capacity. Their use case for black markets is just too great, especially after cash disappears and governments are able to track every fiat payment. How else will people pay for their illicit services and products?

There probably isn't. You'll see a crackdown on cryptocurrencies soon enough, particularly for energy use. That's already begun.

rvz 3y ago
> There probably isn't. Please stop being obtuse. You know there is and there are lots of these cryptocurrencies / blockchains that these people turn to due to the problems above. > You'll see a crackdown on cryptocurrencies soon enough, particularly for energy use. Ethereum 'cracked down' on its energy usage all the way down to 99.99% [0] when it switched from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake. [0] https://consensys.io/blog/ethereum-blockchain-eliminates-99-99-of-its-carbon-footprint-overnight-after-a-successful-merge-according-to-new-report https://consensys.io/blog/ethereum-blockchain-eliminates-99-...
- naasking 3y ago
  You're being obtuse if you think the status quo will be tolerated indefinitely. Not all goods are available via crypto, which means exchanges to and from real currencies are failure points that undermine claims to decentralization. > Ethereum 'cracked down' on its energy usage all the way down to 99.99% [0] when it switched from proof-of-work to proof-of-stake. I was referring to China's crackdown on Bitcoin. Proof-of-stake is no longer fully decentralized, and so vulnerable so sufficiently powerful actors.
  - morkalork 3y ago
    As unlikely as it is, digital payments being regulated as a utility is far more likely than a scenario where entire countries currencies are subverted en mass. Util I can be paid, pay taxes and do everything else, it's a non-solution.
  - rvz 3y ago
    > You're being obtuse if you think the status quo will be tolerated indefinitely. Strawman much? Did I mention that it will be tolerated indefinitely? In fact, I agree that regulations are coming for crypto since it cannot be completely and totally 100% stopped, like it or not. Both will co-exist. > I was referring to China's crackdown on Bitcoin. You didn't mention Bitcoin anywhere in your comment and suggested that a general crackdown on all cryptocurrencies will happen based on their energy usage. Even so in regards to the Bitcoin, what 'crackdown' exactly? [0] [1] [2] > Proof-of-stake is no longer fully decentralized, and so vulnerable so sufficiently powerful actors. Theoretically, but is that why we are still waiting for such powerful actors to fully take over the Ethereum network over its infinitesimal energy usage? [0] https://archive.ph/700H0 https://archive.ph/700H0 [1] https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/2022/bitcoin-mining-new-data-reveal-a-surprising-resurgence/ https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/2022/bitcoin-mining-new-data-revea... [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/18/chinas-underground-bitcoin-miners-.html?utm_term=Autofeed https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/18/chinas-underground-bitcoin-m...
Ridj48dhsnsh 3y ago
I agree that the crackdown will continue, but I'm fairly sure cryptocurrencies will survive in a non-trivial capacity. Their use case for black markets is just too great, especially after cash disappears and governments are able to track every fiat payment. How else will people pay for their illicit services and products?