3 ms·

Now waiting for the catch here because this sounds too good to be true.

j45 3y ago
If you read into it some more Toyota has had this tech for a while, it’s real and it seems to work. Since battery life like this might be a step change, it will leave most EV manufacturers behind if they don’t have an answer. EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out, since old or current tech is not always worth paying new prices for. It might also be a factor in the relationship between Toyota and Tesla growing in the last week.
- SCdF 3y ago
  I know what you mean, but until they release it in a production car it's not really real, if you know what I mean.
  - j45 3y ago
    Absolutely. It's a battery pack though, not a car. Does Toyota have cars with battery packs this battery could be swapped into? That run only on electric for some of the time (Prime). Maybe it's closer than it seems.
- mikestew 3y ago
  EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out I'm not basing my purchase decisions on pie-in-the-sky press releases from Toyota and wild-ass guesses from some random person on the Internet. Build a car, Toyota, then we'll talk. Or maybe I'll just buy a Tesla instead, I've heard that their "Full Self-Driving" is just a few months away.
  - j45 3y ago
    I get your "standard". It's why my recommendation is to actually go look at Toyota's tech. It's not hypothetical or in development. Their solid state batteries are known to exist and be ready to go. "I think I found Toyota's battery" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36980630 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36980630 Which refers to " https://www.nature.com/articles/s41563-022-01421-z https://www.nature.com/articles/s41563-022-01421-z" Maybe some patenting stuff under way? I don't know. Toyota did predict this for a few years ago but things were shut down for the pandemic. Fun reads: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=toyota+battery https://hn.algolia.com/?q=toyota+battery Older teslas driving features are more reliable than the current ones. It sounds like training the AI driving systems with synthetic data is helping speed up progress. Another fn area to read.
- Libcat99 3y ago
  > EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out, since old or current tech is not always worth paying new prices for. Sounds like exactly what Toyota is hoping for with regular press releases like this. Shutting down competitors electric sales while consumers wait for this someday-tech would be fantastic for Toyota. Until you can buy it, it's meaningless at best.
  - j45 3y ago
    See links above. I don't disagree Toyota drags their feet updating their existing cars, let alone new ones. One big move is they did sign that deal with Tesla to adopt the supercharging standard for electric. Hopefully that speeds things up.
    - Libcat99 3y ago
      Toyota is running ads explaining why a battery vehicle isn't the best choice. Right now.
lb1lf 3y ago
One catch would be the massive strain on the AC grid; with an EV consuming some 200Wh or so/km, 1200km equals a capacity of approx. 240kWh. 240kWh in 10 minutes translates into 1,44MW - for charging one car! (Assuming 100% efficiency.) The bottleneck when installing EV charging stations in many parts of Norway at the moment is simply getting the AC oomph needed to the right place. Our electrical ferries (much bigger load than an EV) sidestep this issue by having huge battery banks shoreside, which are being charged at a uniform rate, then once the ferry connects to the shore terminal, it charges off the batteries shoreside rather than the grid as such. Presumably something similar will have to be thought out to take full advantage of solid state batteries.
- mywacaday 3y ago
  Sounds like a win for the battery manufacturer if there has to be a close to matching static capacity of batteries or maybe self driving to somewhere overnight for a quick 10 min charge would be the answer.
- h2odragon 3y ago
  https://www.cat.com/en_US/products/new/power-systems/electric-power/diesel-generator-sets/1000028937.html https://www.cat.com/en_US/products/new/power-systems/electri... no price listed, alas. edit: did find a fuel consumption number; 50% load for a 3MW model should be 45-50gal for 10min (quotes 467gal/hr). so ~14 miles/gallon or 6 km/liter
- maherbeg 3y ago
  This is likely how most charging stations with this power requirement will work too. They will have on-site batteries that are charged at a slower rate to help increase the overall charge speed. Charging stations aren't used 24/7 and this additional battery capacity can absorb day time solar power as needed.

j45 3y ago

If you read into it some more Toyota has had this tech for a while, it’s real and it seems to work. Since battery life like this might be a step change, it will leave most EV manufacturers behind if they don’t have an answer. EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out, since old or current tech is not always worth paying new prices for. It might also be a factor in the relationship between Toyota and Tesla growing in the last week.

SCdF 3y ago
I know what you mean, but until they release it in a production car it's not really real, if you know what I mean.
- j45 3y ago
  Absolutely. It's a battery pack though, not a car. Does Toyota have cars with battery packs this battery could be swapped into? That run only on electric for some of the time (Prime). Maybe it's closer than it seems.
mikestew 3y ago
EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out I'm not basing my purchase decisions on pie-in-the-sky press releases from Toyota and wild-ass guesses from some random person on the Internet. Build a car, Toyota, then we'll talk. Or maybe I'll just buy a Tesla instead, I've heard that their "Full Self-Driving" is just a few months away.
- j45 3y ago
  I get your "standard". It's why my recommendation is to actually go look at Toyota's tech. It's not hypothetical or in development. Their solid state batteries are known to exist and be ready to go. "I think I found Toyota's battery" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36980630 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36980630 Which refers to " https://www.nature.com/articles/s41563-022-01421-z https://www.nature.com/articles/s41563-022-01421-z" Maybe some patenting stuff under way? I don't know. Toyota did predict this for a few years ago but things were shut down for the pandemic. Fun reads: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=toyota+battery https://hn.algolia.com/?q=toyota+battery Older teslas driving features are more reliable than the current ones. It sounds like training the AI driving systems with synthetic data is helping speed up progress. Another fn area to read.
Libcat99 3y ago
> EV buyers may want to consider a used EV until new tech comes out, since old or current tech is not always worth paying new prices for. Sounds like exactly what Toyota is hoping for with regular press releases like this. Shutting down competitors electric sales while consumers wait for this someday-tech would be fantastic for Toyota. Until you can buy it, it's meaningless at best.
- j45 3y ago
  See links above. I don't disagree Toyota drags their feet updating their existing cars, let alone new ones. One big move is they did sign that deal with Tesla to adopt the supercharging standard for electric. Hopefully that speeds things up.
  - Libcat99 3y ago
    Toyota is running ads explaining why a battery vehicle isn't the best choice. Right now.

lb1lf 3y ago

One catch would be the massive strain on the AC grid; with an EV consuming some 200Wh or so/km, 1200km equals a capacity of approx. 240kWh. 240kWh in 10 minutes translates into 1,44MW - for charging one car! (Assuming 100% efficiency.) The bottleneck when installing EV charging stations in many parts of Norway at the moment is simply getting the AC oomph needed to the right place. Our electrical ferries (much bigger load than an EV) sidestep this issue by having huge battery banks shoreside, which are being charged at a uniform rate, then once the ferry connects to the shore terminal, it charges off the batteries shoreside rather than the grid as such. Presumably something similar will have to be thought out to take full advantage of solid state batteries.

mywacaday 3y ago
Sounds like a win for the battery manufacturer if there has to be a close to matching static capacity of batteries or maybe self driving to somewhere overnight for a quick 10 min charge would be the answer.
h2odragon 3y ago
https://www.cat.com/en_US/products/new/power-systems/electric-power/diesel-generator-sets/1000028937.html https://www.cat.com/en_US/products/new/power-systems/electri... no price listed, alas. edit: did find a fuel consumption number; 50% load for a 3MW model should be 45-50gal for 10min (quotes 467gal/hr). so ~14 miles/gallon or 6 km/liter
maherbeg 3y ago
This is likely how most charging stations with this power requirement will work too. They will have on-site batteries that are charged at a slower rate to help increase the overall charge speed. Charging stations aren't used 24/7 and this additional battery capacity can absorb day time solar power as needed.