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There are plenty of solutions within the law that aren't a grey area. As an example, send a DMCA/C&D to shopify.com - do they have to take down their homepage?

There are plenty of solutions within the law that aren't a grey area. As an example, send a DMCA/C&D to shopify.com - do they have to take down their homepage? Of course not. Did they set up a robot to take down their homepage when it receives a request? Of course not. > DMCA has no concept of fraud prevention Yes it does. The safe harbor requirements require that material removed expeditously upon proper notice. A bogus notice is not proper notice. Acting on a bogus notice is against shopify's own notice and takedown procedure. They are creating more harm for themselves by doing this.

ensignavenger 3y ago
But if the recipient gets it wrong and misclassifies a proper notice as a bogus notice, they are liable under the law. There is no safe harbor for "we acted in good faith but we were wrong".
- bluGill 3y ago
  The real problem is Shopify is not the one who should receive this notice. They should act like a post office and pass it onto their users. Shopify should only do more if the poster does not respond in a reasonable amount of time, or if a court order is obtained. (Or of course the user takes things down). Of course a user responding to leave content up needs to provide their legal contact information so this can go to court.
  - freedomben 3y ago
    But if they don't take it down as soon as they are "notified" then they lose the safe harbor protections. I find the DMCA enraging but the law is pretty clear. You incur some liability by not taking down immediately, and no lawyer or business is going to incur liability when they don't have to.
    - bluGill 3y ago
      What I wrote is how the law should have been written (IMHO), not how it is. You are correct the law forces them to act as they do.
some_random 3y ago
Fraud prevention is a lot more than "you don't have to respond to a bogus notice"
onionisafruit 3y ago
The difference with the home page is that it isn’t subject to safe harbor like third party content assuming the home page doesn’t contain user content (I haven’t actually looked). Shopify is already civilly liable for copyright issues on their home page. Since they have no safe harbor, there is no reason to follow the safe harbor rules.
thomastjeffery 3y ago
The website operator is obviously prepared to file a counter-notice in respect to their own content. What they are not prepared to defend is their users' content.

ensignavenger 3y ago

But if the recipient gets it wrong and misclassifies a proper notice as a bogus notice, they are liable under the law. There is no safe harbor for "we acted in good faith but we were wrong".

bluGill 3y ago
The real problem is Shopify is not the one who should receive this notice. They should act like a post office and pass it onto their users. Shopify should only do more if the poster does not respond in a reasonable amount of time, or if a court order is obtained. (Or of course the user takes things down). Of course a user responding to leave content up needs to provide their legal contact information so this can go to court.
- freedomben 3y ago
  But if they don't take it down as soon as they are "notified" then they lose the safe harbor protections. I find the DMCA enraging but the law is pretty clear. You incur some liability by not taking down immediately, and no lawyer or business is going to incur liability when they don't have to.
  - bluGill 3y ago
    What I wrote is how the law should have been written (IMHO), not how it is. You are correct the law forces them to act as they do.

some_random 3y ago

Fraud prevention is a lot more than "you don't have to respond to a bogus notice"

onionisafruit 3y ago

The difference with the home page is that it isn’t subject to safe harbor like third party content assuming the home page doesn’t contain user content (I haven’t actually looked). Shopify is already civilly liable for copyright issues on their home page. Since they have no safe harbor, there is no reason to follow the safe harbor rules.

thomastjeffery 3y ago

The website operator is obviously prepared to file a counter-notice in respect to their own content. What they are not prepared to defend is their users' content.