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> reaching the point where you never need to work again? You don't want to reach that point. You want to stay below that point, because what brings satisfactio

> reaching the point where you never need to work again? You don't want to reach that point. You want to stay below that point, because what brings satisfaction and happiness in life is something called the "power process". The Unabomber explained it well [1]. The Unabomber unfortunately used bad methods to spread his ideas, but the ideas themselves were good. [1] https://medium.com/chris-messina/surrogate-activities-the-power-process-16203dda87 https://medium.com/chris-messina/surrogate-activities-the-po...

saurik 3y ago
There are many goals you can set and achieve that require effort but don't relate to needing to work to make money. Maybe I'm somehow crazy on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs"... but, I like to do stuff like learn to sing and play the guitar, speak new languages, get better at drawing and painting, or plunge ever deeper into the worlds of math and physics... all of which seems eminently compatible with this "power process" thesis and which are all much more pleasant when you don't simultaneously have to work.
- breadwinner 3y ago
  Those are surrogate activities, and according to the article, they are less satisfying than the pursuit of real goals (see last paragraph). The point is that when you have to work for a living, and you are successful at that, that is much more satisfying than being successful at a hobby. That sounds about right to me!
  - ghaff 3y ago
    I didn't really get that from the last paragraph. Though I suppose it partly depends if you got a windfall at 30 or if you're just retiring early at 50.
  - syndicatedjelly 3y ago
    > 9. No one is going to remember you in 100 years. So you might as well focus on what’s going to make you happy now, instead of what money might buy you in the future. There is a Scottish proverb: Be happy while you are living, for you are a long time dead. That sounds like the exact opposite of what you're saying.
- nostrademons 3y ago
  Many of those don't need anywhere close to "never need to work again" money, only "2-3 years savings, or a willingness to half-ass your job". You just need the courage to make it a priority. It's entirely possible to do most of those as a hobby. If you do need to go full-time on it, you can usually accomplish a lot in 2-3 years, and then jump back into the workforce when you get bored with your hobbies.
  - teucris 3y ago
    > You just need the courage to make it a priority. And money. Living modestly and pursue hobbies is much, much harder to accomplish financially than it seems for most people. I don’t want to make this a conversation about healthcare, but that’s a huge part.
- ghaff 3y ago
  Many (most?) people do like to "do something." But my observation is that many--especially later career--with a reasonable pile of money are pretty happy to travel, read, write, volunteer, watch live or other entertainment, putter around the house, etc. They may do things but don't necessarily really work in the sense that they have a lot of obligations and deliverables.
- jareklupinski 3y ago
  > Maybe I'm somehow crazy on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs"... but, I like to do stuff like learn to sing and play the guitar, speak new languages, get better at drawing and painting, or plunge ever deeper into the worlds of math and physics... all of which seems eminently compatible with this "power process" thesis and which are all much more pleasant when you don't simultaneously have to work i think if you reached the point where you solved the thesis, don't have to work, and you're doing all those things... you're not coming back to post about it on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs" :^) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_cave#Return_to_the_cave https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_cave#Return_to...
- rhombocombus 3y ago
  Amen saurik! Nice seeing you here and at Milongas. Here’s to enjoying joy and beauty.
danaris 3y ago
"Never need to work again" != "Never work again" There are dozens of reasons to want to have enough money that, no matter what happens, you know you won't end up homeless and destitute. And unfortunately, in America today, that's a lot of money, due to our for-profit healthcare system making medical emergencies sometimes cost millions of dollars. If I were handed enough money tomorrow that it would guarantee I and my family would never have to work another day in our lives, I don't think any of us would choose not to work. Instead, we'd be free to choose work that we want to do, rather than worrying about what will pay well enough to keep us fed and housed.
- teucris 3y ago
  Thank you, I had chosen those words carefully for this very reason.

saurik 3y ago

There are many goals you can set and achieve that require effort but don't relate to needing to work to make money. Maybe I'm somehow crazy on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs"... but, I like to do stuff like learn to sing and play the guitar, speak new languages, get better at drawing and painting, or plunge ever deeper into the worlds of math and physics... all of which seems eminently compatible with this "power process" thesis and which are all much more pleasant when you don't simultaneously have to work.

breadwinner 3y ago
Those are surrogate activities, and according to the article, they are less satisfying than the pursuit of real goals (see last paragraph). The point is that when you have to work for a living, and you are successful at that, that is much more satisfying than being successful at a hobby. That sounds about right to me!
- ghaff 3y ago
  I didn't really get that from the last paragraph. Though I suppose it partly depends if you got a windfall at 30 or if you're just retiring early at 50.
- syndicatedjelly 3y ago
  > 9. No one is going to remember you in 100 years. So you might as well focus on what’s going to make you happy now, instead of what money might buy you in the future. There is a Scottish proverb: Be happy while you are living, for you are a long time dead. That sounds like the exact opposite of what you're saying.
nostrademons 3y ago
Many of those don't need anywhere close to "never need to work again" money, only "2-3 years savings, or a willingness to half-ass your job". You just need the courage to make it a priority. It's entirely possible to do most of those as a hobby. If you do need to go full-time on it, you can usually accomplish a lot in 2-3 years, and then jump back into the workforce when you get bored with your hobbies.
- teucris 3y ago
  > You just need the courage to make it a priority. And money. Living modestly and pursue hobbies is much, much harder to accomplish financially than it seems for most people. I don’t want to make this a conversation about healthcare, but that’s a huge part.
ghaff 3y ago
Many (most?) people do like to "do something." But my observation is that many--especially later career--with a reasonable pile of money are pretty happy to travel, read, write, volunteer, watch live or other entertainment, putter around the house, etc. They may do things but don't necessarily really work in the sense that they have a lot of obligations and deliverables.
jareklupinski 3y ago
> Maybe I'm somehow crazy on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs"... but, I like to do stuff like learn to sing and play the guitar, speak new languages, get better at drawing and painting, or plunge ever deeper into the worlds of math and physics... all of which seems eminently compatible with this "power process" thesis and which are all much more pleasant when you don't simultaneously have to work i think if you reached the point where you solved the thesis, don't have to work, and you're doing all those things... you're not coming back to post about it on a forum of tech "entrepreneurs" :^) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_cave#Return_to_the_cave https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_cave#Return_to...
rhombocombus 3y ago
Amen saurik! Nice seeing you here and at Milongas. Here’s to enjoying joy and beauty.

danaris 3y ago

"Never need to work again" != "Never work again" There are dozens of reasons to want to have enough money that, no matter what happens, you know you won't end up homeless and destitute. And unfortunately, in America today, that's a lot of money, due to our for-profit healthcare system making medical emergencies sometimes cost millions of dollars. If I were handed enough money tomorrow that it would guarantee I and my family would never have to work another day in our lives, I don't think any of us would choose not to work. Instead, we'd be free to choose work that we want to do, rather than worrying about what will pay well enough to keep us fed and housed.

teucris 3y ago
Thank you, I had chosen those words carefully for this very reason.