4 ms·

the more I look, the more Ruffle seems to speed along. how did they get so good (and this fast) ?!?

TheDong 3y ago
Unironically, because of rust. Rust's type system encodes more information than most languages, and so you can offload more work to it. That becomes more and more valuable as the project grows. Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly.
- bsder 3y ago
  > Rust's type system encodes more information than most languages, and so you can offload more work to it. I suspect at least one of the developers would argue with you as I have listened to his rants. :) Rust is a remarkably poor match to implementing Flash because Flash has lots of object orientation with child and parent pointers--which Rust really hates. > Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly. I suspect this is way more relevant.
  - teaearlgraycold 3y ago
    Couldn’t you just have a global object table and make your pointers indexes into this, using Rc::Refcells throughout? Rust is still fast with runtime GC.
  - adrian17 3y ago
    More specifically (assuming we’re talking about the same thing), the issue is with reproducing a standard C++ inheritance hierarchy (used for both the AS2/3 native objects and for the „DOM” tree nodes), while keeping its overhead characteristics, devirtualisation opportunities, having it interact with our GC and borrow checker and still have a convenient, safe Rust API on top. Our current solution works, but has deficiencies in most of these aspects.
  - pcwalton 3y ago
    I suspect that it's two things: (1) the relatively good support for Wasm in Rust; (2) the Cargo ecosystem. In the case of Ruffle, the combination of the two seems particularly effective.
- subtra3t 3y ago
  > Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly. Could you elaborate more on this? I don't think programmers that primarily use a particular language would be anymore skilled than programmers that rely on another language.
  - steveklabnik 3y ago
    I am not going to make the claim that Rust devs are better, but when most people on this website make these sorts of claims, they are often referring to http://www.paulgraham.com/pypar.html http://www.paulgraham.com/pypar.html Note that a lot has changed since 2004 :)
    - subtra3t 3y ago
      Thanks!
Cloudef 3y ago
probably because of the sponsors
- tetris11 3y ago
  Newgrounds being one

Unironically, because of rust. Rust's type system encodes more information than most languages, and so you can offload more work to it. That becomes more and more valuable as the project grows. Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly.

bsder 3y ago
> Rust's type system encodes more information than most languages, and so you can offload more work to it. I suspect at least one of the developers would argue with you as I have listened to his rants. :) Rust is a remarkably poor match to implementing Flash because Flash has lots of object orientation with child and parent pointers--which Rust really hates. > Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly. I suspect this is way more relevant.
- teaearlgraycold 3y ago
  Couldn’t you just have a global object table and make your pointers indexes into this, using Rc::Refcells throughout? Rust is still fast with runtime GC.
- adrian17 3y ago
  More specifically (assuming we’re talking about the same thing), the issue is with reproducing a standard C++ inheritance hierarchy (used for both the AS2/3 native objects and for the „DOM” tree nodes), while keeping its overhead characteristics, devirtualisation opportunities, having it interact with our GC and borrow checker and still have a convenient, safe Rust API on top. Our current solution works, but has deficiencies in most of these aspects.
- pcwalton 3y ago
  I suspect that it's two things: (1) the relatively good support for Wasm in Rust; (2) the Cargo ecosystem. In the case of Ruffle, the combination of the two seems particularly effective.
subtra3t 3y ago
> Rust also attracts good developers in general, moreso than the average language certainly. Could you elaborate more on this? I don't think programmers that primarily use a particular language would be anymore skilled than programmers that rely on another language.
- steveklabnik 3y ago
  I am not going to make the claim that Rust devs are better, but when most people on this website make these sorts of claims, they are often referring to http://www.paulgraham.com/pypar.html http://www.paulgraham.com/pypar.html Note that a lot has changed since 2004 :)
  - subtra3t 3y ago
    Thanks!

Cloudef 3y ago

probably because of the sponsors

tetris11 3y ago
Newgrounds being one