26 ms·

It's mad, no? When I ask people point blank why they're getting married, they just stare at me. Obviously part of that is because I'm being autistically rude in

by ghusto 3y ago

It's mad, no? When I ask people point blank why they're getting married, they just stare at me. Obviously part of that is because I'm being autistically rude in asking such a questions, but I haven't heard any compelling answers either.

saiya-jin 3y ago
Well if you ask such an autistic question (given that I am responding to a adult person and not some small kid who doesn't have a clue about actual life), don't expect much, it clearly signalizes that you are either taking a piss or are so immature there is no point even discussing it. Its a bit like asking why do you like color blue, mature adults don't ask that and for kids you can say anything or nothing, same result. But I'll bite - if you decide to settle down with a partner you match with very well on tons of actually important stuff, including how your future together could look like while lacking any significant (yet known) drawbacks, and you want to raise kid(s) together, then the question is why not. Without the kids part, less reasons but why not. The inexperienced people (in my case immature kids/teens, I've answered similar but better formed question couple of times already) think its just a paper signed, and contractual obligations stemming from it. Far from it, at least for us. It changed our relationship, for the better, made it stronger and not only due to longer cancellation procedure. Do I have some peer-reviewed study for that? Of course not, just my personal 2 cents.
- hx8 3y ago
  As an adult that is seen as mature by my peers who happens to not understand marriage your post comes off as lacking empathy and also not doing a lot to explain why someone would choose marriage. The reasons I extracted for why someone would want to choose marriage. * "Why not" * Changes the relationship for the better * The relationship has longer cancellation procedure.
  - saiya-jin 3y ago
    You have no idea how you are actually viewed by your peers, here for example you are far from it, pretty consistently, trying hard to find reasons to prove your own personal opinions, while ignoring others. A bit pointless debate at this point, since your own second asterix is more than enough for the topic discussed. But to each their own.
- ghusto 3y ago
  Aaaand, that's the answer I usually get; why not. I can come up with a few very good reasons why not, but the question was why. You mention that after you decided "why not", and got married, you in fact saw your relationship get "stronger and not only due to longer cancellation procedure". I'm happy it's working out for you, but would suggest it's not because you got married.
danielmarkbruce 3y ago
Well, it's a naive question. And it shows laziness given the answer can be found at google or chatgpt (https://chat.openai.com/share/a1655efa-05e1-4ad0-97ca-62439dc18c67 https://chat.openai.com/share/a1655efa-05e1-4ad0-97ca-62439d...). Most people are aware of such things and can't quite figure how to explain it to someone who isn't, or can't figure out Google. Hence the stare.
- ghusto 3y ago
  Can't tell if you're serious. Literally everything on their is either not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. I won't go through each nonsense reason in turn, but this one is pertinent: > Accountability and Conflict Resolution > > Resolution Mechanisms: Marriage often compels couples to work out their differences and disputes in a more committed manner, as there is more at stake. The opposite is true. People take marriage as a binary thing, and over-react to "last straw" situations. They get divorced, and that's the end. People in committed relationships work things out, because there's a whole lot of grey. I've been in a relationship longer than most married couples I know, and I'm still seeing divorces every day at my kids school.
  - danielmarkbruce 3y ago
    Serious. >> Literally everything is not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings. Maybe go through "literally everything". The first two on the list, for example, and consider many different jurisdictions. The cherry picked example is even wrong. In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has it for couples with kids, several US states have it. So there are all the regular reasons to try to resolve things, plus added reasons. The anecdote is nothing more than that. No one is claiming marriage is a cure all for all relationships. No one is claiming only marriages are durable relationships. But the idea that there is no practical reason to get married is absurd. Just making a loud, expensive, public announcement that "I'll do x" is known to make it more likely that you'll do x.
    - 3y ago
mensetmanusman 3y ago
Getting married forces difficult confrontations that many relationships get to bypass by breaking up. If you make it through the difficult confrontations your relationship gains robustness and is better for your offspring.
- ghusto 3y ago
  I find it's the opposite. Marriages break up because it's a binary thing; they either get through the "last straw", or they get divorced. Contrast that with people in committed relationships who have a sea of grey to work with, and eventually make it work when it could have been a divorce if they were married. I have no data, but I'd bet there are more 40 year olds in relationships of over 20 years than there are married people.
  - mensetmanusman 3y ago
    Marriage as an institution is mostly about offspring. A sea of grey might be where children drown.
- lazide 3y ago
  Ho man. Clearly you’ve never sat in family court for any length of time. Marriage turns dysfunctional dynamics from small time private affairs into society mediated wars of attrition. It stops nothing and magnifies the damage and misery one party can inflict on another in worst case scenarios. A typical Silicon Valley contested divorce costs $250-450k, and 5-10 years before it concludes last I checked.
  - mensetmanusman 3y ago
    Judging the institution by its edge cases may put blinders on one’s conclusion.
    - lazide 3y ago
      Ignoring an institutions (common) edge cases will definitely put blinders on one’s conclusions.
anon291 3y ago
Marriage is a formal process that provides a standard framework in which two families get to know one another. The problem with American relationships is that it deals with two people. A marriage is the full joining of two full families. By marrying my wife, I made my uncle related to my wife's uncle, so they better kind of get along. Indeed I have a vested interest in them getting along because it benefits my children. A wedding provides a formal and socially acceptable way for these sorts of interactions to occur. If I just moved in with my wife... What are the chances her distant cousins would meet mine? Zero, I imagine. A wedding brings them together and benefits everyone. But most Americans don't really have extended families so I see why weddings seem strange.
- ghusto 3y ago
  Bingo! First actual answer to the question. I hadn't thought of the extended family benefit, and that's maybe a good one. Though I will say from all I can tell, our families have had the same level of mingling that they would have had we got married. Could be wrong though. But yes, many western cultures don't really have close extended families, so even this point is mostly null. I have an inkling as to why people get married in the west, but I don't want to be set on fire here ;)
  - anon291 3y ago
    > I hadn't thought of the extended family benefit, and that's maybe a good one. Though I will say from all I can tell, our families have had the same level of mingling that they would have had we got married. Could be wrong though. But maybe if marriage were more prevalent culturally, they would have? > But yes, many western cultures don't really have close extended families, so even this point is mostly null. Western culture is also rife with divorce, which creates a culture in which extended family doesn't actually want to meet, since divorce is like 50/50. Of course, in subcultures in America, like Mormons, certain Asian cultures, traditional Catholics, Orthodox Jews, Amish, etc, there is quite a bit of extended family, and these cultures heavily discourage divorce. So it's pretty hard to detangle causation and correlation? Does extended family prevent divorce? or do intact nuclear families cause extended families? Or is it a feedback loop, that reinforces another? In that case, what is the most prudent action any individual can take to put the process in the right direction?
Bilal_io 3y ago
Possibly you're not seeing the answers you're given as compelling because of your perspective. I can speak from an Islamic perspective and say that sexual relationships are considered immoral outside of marriage, so a man and woman cannot create a family and have kids unless they get married.
- perryizgr8 3y ago
  > sexual relationships are considered immoral outside of marriage, so a man and woman cannot create a family and have kids unless they get married. People commit immoral acts in all cultures.
  - lazide 3y ago
    And they have to hide them or get the (expected) backlash.
circlefavshape 3y ago
Once you get beyond a certain age if you mention your girlfriend in conversation people will assume she's some young thing you left your wife for. Marriage means you avoid this awkward situation
- ghusto 3y ago
  Yes, I have that. People think she must be a recent thing, when I call her my girlfriend. I don't mind.
snapcaster 3y ago
This is really cringe and you're probably not being perceived by others the way you think. I would suggest avoiding asking leading questions like this, it makes you sound like a child or at the very least an incredibly sheltered adult

by ghusto 3y ago

saiya-jin 3y ago

Well if you ask such an autistic question (given that I am responding to a adult person and not some small kid who doesn't have a clue about actual life), don't expect much, it clearly signalizes that you are either taking a piss or are so immature there is no point even discussing it. Its a bit like asking why do you like color blue, mature adults don't ask that and for kids you can say anything or nothing, same result. But I'll bite - if you decide to settle down with a partner you match with very well on tons of actually important stuff, including how your future together could look like while lacking any significant (yet known) drawbacks, and you want to raise kid(s) together, then the question is why not. Without the kids part, less reasons but why not. The inexperienced people (in my case immature kids/teens, I've answered similar but better formed question couple of times already) think its just a paper signed, and contractual obligations stemming from it. Far from it, at least for us. It changed our relationship, for the better, made it stronger and not only due to longer cancellation procedure. Do I have some peer-reviewed study for that? Of course not, just my personal 2 cents.

hx8 3y ago
As an adult that is seen as mature by my peers who happens to not understand marriage your post comes off as lacking empathy and also not doing a lot to explain why someone would choose marriage. The reasons I extracted for why someone would want to choose marriage. * "Why not" * Changes the relationship for the better * The relationship has longer cancellation procedure.
- saiya-jin 3y ago
  You have no idea how you are actually viewed by your peers, here for example you are far from it, pretty consistently, trying hard to find reasons to prove your own personal opinions, while ignoring others. A bit pointless debate at this point, since your own second asterix is more than enough for the topic discussed. But to each their own.
ghusto 3y ago
Aaaand, that's the answer I usually get; why not. I can come up with a few very good reasons why not, but the question was why. You mention that after you decided "why not", and got married, you in fact saw your relationship get "stronger and not only due to longer cancellation procedure". I'm happy it's working out for you, but would suggest it's not because you got married.

danielmarkbruce 3y ago

Well, it's a naive question. And it shows laziness given the answer can be found at google or chatgpt (https://chat.openai.com/share/a1655efa-05e1-4ad0-97ca-62439dc18c67 https://chat.openai.com/share/a1655efa-05e1-4ad0-97ca-62439d...). Most people are aware of such things and can't quite figure how to explain it to someone who isn't, or can't figure out Google. Hence the stare.

ghusto 3y ago
Can't tell if you're serious. Literally everything on their is either not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. I won't go through each nonsense reason in turn, but this one is pertinent: > Accountability and Conflict Resolution > > Resolution Mechanisms: Marriage often compels couples to work out their differences and disputes in a more committed manner, as there is more at stake. The opposite is true. People take marriage as a binary thing, and over-react to "last straw" situations. They get divorced, and that's the end. People in committed relationships work things out, because there's a whole lot of grey. I've been in a relationship longer than most married couples I know, and I'm still seeing divorces every day at my kids school.
- danielmarkbruce 3y ago
  Serious. >> Literally everything is not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings. Maybe go through "literally everything". The first two on the list, for example, and consider many different jurisdictions. The cherry picked example is even wrong. In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has it for couples with kids, several US states have it. So there are all the regular reasons to try to resolve things, plus added reasons. The anecdote is nothing more than that. No one is claiming marriage is a cure all for all relationships. No one is claiming only marriages are durable relationships. But the idea that there is no practical reason to get married is absurd. Just making a loud, expensive, public announcement that "I'll do x" is known to make it more likely that you'll do x.
  - 3y ago

mensetmanusman 3y ago

Getting married forces difficult confrontations that many relationships get to bypass by breaking up. If you make it through the difficult confrontations your relationship gains robustness and is better for your offspring.

ghusto 3y ago
I find it's the opposite. Marriages break up because it's a binary thing; they either get through the "last straw", or they get divorced. Contrast that with people in committed relationships who have a sea of grey to work with, and eventually make it work when it could have been a divorce if they were married. I have no data, but I'd bet there are more 40 year olds in relationships of over 20 years than there are married people.
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Marriage as an institution is mostly about offspring. A sea of grey might be where children drown.
lazide 3y ago
Ho man. Clearly you’ve never sat in family court for any length of time. Marriage turns dysfunctional dynamics from small time private affairs into society mediated wars of attrition. It stops nothing and magnifies the damage and misery one party can inflict on another in worst case scenarios. A typical Silicon Valley contested divorce costs $250-450k, and 5-10 years before it concludes last I checked.
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Judging the institution by its edge cases may put blinders on one’s conclusion.
  - lazide 3y ago
    Ignoring an institutions (common) edge cases will definitely put blinders on one’s conclusions.

anon291 3y ago

Marriage is a formal process that provides a standard framework in which two families get to know one another. The problem with American relationships is that it deals with two people. A marriage is the full joining of two full families. By marrying my wife, I made my uncle related to my wife's uncle, so they better kind of get along. Indeed I have a vested interest in them getting along because it benefits my children. A wedding provides a formal and socially acceptable way for these sorts of interactions to occur. If I just moved in with my wife... What are the chances her distant cousins would meet mine? Zero, I imagine. A wedding brings them together and benefits everyone. But most Americans don't really have extended families so I see why weddings seem strange.

ghusto 3y ago
Bingo! First actual answer to the question. I hadn't thought of the extended family benefit, and that's maybe a good one. Though I will say from all I can tell, our families have had the same level of mingling that they would have had we got married. Could be wrong though. But yes, many western cultures don't really have close extended families, so even this point is mostly null. I have an inkling as to why people get married in the west, but I don't want to be set on fire here ;)
- anon291 3y ago
  > I hadn't thought of the extended family benefit, and that's maybe a good one. Though I will say from all I can tell, our families have had the same level of mingling that they would have had we got married. Could be wrong though. But maybe if marriage were more prevalent culturally, they would have? > But yes, many western cultures don't really have close extended families, so even this point is mostly null. Western culture is also rife with divorce, which creates a culture in which extended family doesn't actually want to meet, since divorce is like 50/50. Of course, in subcultures in America, like Mormons, certain Asian cultures, traditional Catholics, Orthodox Jews, Amish, etc, there is quite a bit of extended family, and these cultures heavily discourage divorce. So it's pretty hard to detangle causation and correlation? Does extended family prevent divorce? or do intact nuclear families cause extended families? Or is it a feedback loop, that reinforces another? In that case, what is the most prudent action any individual can take to put the process in the right direction?

Bilal_io 3y ago

Possibly you're not seeing the answers you're given as compelling because of your perspective. I can speak from an Islamic perspective and say that sexual relationships are considered immoral outside of marriage, so a man and woman cannot create a family and have kids unless they get married.

perryizgr8 3y ago
> sexual relationships are considered immoral outside of marriage, so a man and woman cannot create a family and have kids unless they get married. People commit immoral acts in all cultures.
- lazide 3y ago
  And they have to hide them or get the (expected) backlash.

circlefavshape 3y ago

Once you get beyond a certain age if you mention your girlfriend in conversation people will assume she's some young thing you left your wife for. Marriage means you avoid this awkward situation

ghusto 3y ago
Yes, I have that. People think she must be a recent thing, when I call her my girlfriend. I don't mind.

snapcaster 3y ago

This is really cringe and you're probably not being perceived by others the way you think. I would suggest avoiding asking leading questions like this, it makes you sound like a child or at the very least an incredibly sheltered adult