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This is the thing I'm finding frustrating. I don't care what "team" people think they're on. The reality on the ground is for regular people there are no teams

This is the thing I'm finding frustrating. I don't care what "team" people think they're on. The reality on the ground is for regular people there are no teams and it's just tragedy. But I'm seeing a lot of vociferous blow-back on the Gaza hospital thing -- maybe rightfully so -- but so much less on the other "side." When concerns were brought up about the beheading things, and other claims of veracity it was treated as callous quibbling. This is not whataboutism: The fundamental reality is it doesn't in the grand scheme of things matter who caused the casualties in the specific instance in the hospital. What matters is that a cessation of conflict is not being considered, and that civilians are being murdered by political actors as a result. Any ethical grown-up in charge would be working to de-escalate.

bluefishinit 3y ago
I agree. The bombing didn't stop after the hospital. Shortly after a major bakery was bombed by Israel, another yesterday along with the third oldest church in the world that was harboring people who lost their houses. The bombing continues now, 6000 bombs were dropped before the hospital bomb. Thousands of civilians in Gaza have died and that's just getting started. The focus should be on an immediate ceasefire and humanitarian aide.
- lazystar 3y ago
  If those hostages are still alive, those bombs at least serve the purpose of letting them know their government is not sitting idly by.
- tzs 3y ago
  > Thousands of civilians in Gaza have died and that's just getting started. The focus should be on an immediate ceasefire and humanitarian aide. Then what?
- chmod600 3y ago
  There are different causes of violence and a ceasefire solves some kinds but not others. For instance, fear is a major driver of violence: attack "them" to reduce their ability to attack "us". A ceasefire is a good solution here, because it develops a mutual trust that you'll leave each other alone. But if there are other reasons for attack, e.g. one party is unhappy with the status quo and sees something to be gained by violence, a ceasefire doesn't work. They will just wait for the next opportunity and strike again, regardless of how peaceful the situation is. I'm not making a moral statement here, just a practical one. A ceasefire today would not magically make everyone content to leave each other alone.

bluefishinit 3y ago

I agree. The bombing didn't stop after the hospital. Shortly after a major bakery was bombed by Israel, another yesterday along with the third oldest church in the world that was harboring people who lost their houses. The bombing continues now, 6000 bombs were dropped before the hospital bomb. Thousands of civilians in Gaza have died and that's just getting started. The focus should be on an immediate ceasefire and humanitarian aide.

lazystar 3y ago
If those hostages are still alive, those bombs at least serve the purpose of letting them know their government is not sitting idly by.
tzs 3y ago
> Thousands of civilians in Gaza have died and that's just getting started. The focus should be on an immediate ceasefire and humanitarian aide. Then what?
chmod600 3y ago
There are different causes of violence and a ceasefire solves some kinds but not others. For instance, fear is a major driver of violence: attack "them" to reduce their ability to attack "us". A ceasefire is a good solution here, because it develops a mutual trust that you'll leave each other alone. But if there are other reasons for attack, e.g. one party is unhappy with the status quo and sees something to be gained by violence, a ceasefire doesn't work. They will just wait for the next opportunity and strike again, regardless of how peaceful the situation is. I'm not making a moral statement here, just a practical one. A ceasefire today would not magically make everyone content to leave each other alone.