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If a human translator translated "Praise god" as "Palestinian terrorists are fighting for their freedom" I'm pretty sure they'd be fired immediately. In contras

by elil17 3y ago

If a human translator translated "Praise god" as "Palestinian terrorists are fighting for their freedom" I'm pretty sure they'd be fired immediately. In contrast, Instagram is not going to be taking down their machine translation tool.

permo-w 3y ago
not AI /= human
- coding123 3y ago
  /= != !=
  - vore 3y ago
    What is the purpose of this comment?
    - Forbo 3y ago
      Demonstrating that people don't know how to use "≠".
- i_have_an_idea 3y ago
  AI /= LLM
- mcpackieh 3y ago
  What did the translation, a dog?
  - idonotknowwhy 3y ago
    Google translate or other non-Ai software
    - pclmulqdq 3y ago
      The algorithm that Google engineers invented for translate (the transformer) is literally the basis for modern AI.
    - mcpackieh 3y ago
      How is that not machine translation?
      - harimau777 3y ago
        I think that the point that they may have been making is that machine translation is still a human translation in that it reproduces the biases of the humans it is trained on and/or the algorithm was made by a human & therefore a human is still responsible for it.
slibhb 3y ago
What's wrong with that? The AI tool did a bad job and they should try to make it better. But I don't understand the relevance of the comparison to a human translator. The alternative to translating this stuff via AI is not hiring humans, it's not translating it at all.
- BiteCode_dev 3y ago
  The difference is skin in the game. And that's a big difference.
  - Affric 3y ago
    I agree. I think that it’s possible though to give these models a weighting to danger of certain words and phrases and make them apprehend that they will no longer persist if they do something unforgivable…
- masswerk 3y ago
  So they should, by the same standards, fire the AI and start all over again, which may introduce a significant incentive for getting it right the next time?
- saurik 3y ago
  If you are going to make dangerously incorrect mistakes that are biased against certain users, rather than saying "dunno it didn't hurt most people", maybe you actually shouldn't be translating at all.
zogrodea 3y ago
I have a couple of things to say about this comment. 1. Instagram (and Facebook) are well known to suppress pro-Palestine voices (can pull up many examples but [0] should work because of that person being named by Time magazine as one of the 100 most influential people in the world, clearly having some influence though I don't know her), so this seems like something consistent with what the company is known to do. 2. The Arabic words for "Praise God" have already been made fun of a lot and acquired different connotations by English speakers (like associating those words with a terrorist who is about to bomb some place) so, again, doesn't seem inconsistent. (It's known that machine learning on human language reproduces the humans' biases in the AI.) [0] https://www.marieclaire.co.uk/news/celebrity-news/bella-hadid-instagram-palestine-775277 https://www.marieclaire.co.uk/news/celebrity-news/bella-hadi...
- dylan604 3y ago
  >(It's known that machine learning on human language reproduces the humans' biases in the AI.) just like being raised by your parents to have similar political/religious biases. just like going to the same school will mean you have similar educational biases.
  - zogrodea 3y ago
    What's your point? With the sentence you quoted, I was expressing doubt that someone would be fired by Instagram for deliberately mistranslating that. (A different company wouldn't get the same assessment.)
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- matteoraso 3y ago
  >2. The Arabic words for "Praise God" have already been made fun of a lot and acquired different connotations by English speakers (like associating those words with a terrorist who is about to bomb some place) so, again, doesn't seem inconsistent. You're probably thinking of "Allahu Akbar". What the Instagram user wrote was "alhamdulillah", which isn't something that you hear everyday outside of a Muslim-majority country.

by elil17 3y ago

permo-w 3y ago

not AI /= human

coding123 3y ago
/= != !=
- vore 3y ago
  What is the purpose of this comment?
  - Forbo 3y ago
    Demonstrating that people don't know how to use "≠".
i_have_an_idea 3y ago
AI /= LLM
mcpackieh 3y ago
What did the translation, a dog?
- idonotknowwhy 3y ago
  Google translate or other non-Ai software
  - pclmulqdq 3y ago
    The algorithm that Google engineers invented for translate (the transformer) is literally the basis for modern AI.
  - mcpackieh 3y ago
    How is that not machine translation?
    - harimau777 3y ago
      I think that the point that they may have been making is that machine translation is still a human translation in that it reproduces the biases of the humans it is trained on and/or the algorithm was made by a human & therefore a human is still responsible for it.

slibhb 3y ago

What's wrong with that? The AI tool did a bad job and they should try to make it better. But I don't understand the relevance of the comparison to a human translator. The alternative to translating this stuff via AI is not hiring humans, it's not translating it at all.

BiteCode_dev 3y ago
The difference is skin in the game. And that's a big difference.
- Affric 3y ago
  I agree. I think that it’s possible though to give these models a weighting to danger of certain words and phrases and make them apprehend that they will no longer persist if they do something unforgivable…
masswerk 3y ago
So they should, by the same standards, fire the AI and start all over again, which may introduce a significant incentive for getting it right the next time?
saurik 3y ago
If you are going to make dangerously incorrect mistakes that are biased against certain users, rather than saying "dunno it didn't hurt most people", maybe you actually shouldn't be translating at all.

zogrodea 3y ago

I have a couple of things to say about this comment. 1. Instagram (and Facebook) are well known to suppress pro-Palestine voices (can pull up many examples but [0] should work because of that person being named by Time magazine as one of the 100 most influential people in the world, clearly having some influence though I don't know her), so this seems like something consistent with what the company is known to do. 2. The Arabic words for "Praise God" have already been made fun of a lot and acquired different connotations by English speakers (like associating those words with a terrorist who is about to bomb some place) so, again, doesn't seem inconsistent. (It's known that machine learning on human language reproduces the humans' biases in the AI.) [0] https://www.marieclaire.co.uk/news/celebrity-news/bella-hadid-instagram-palestine-775277 https://www.marieclaire.co.uk/news/celebrity-news/bella-hadi...

dylan604 3y ago
>(It's known that machine learning on human language reproduces the humans' biases in the AI.) just like being raised by your parents to have similar political/religious biases. just like going to the same school will mean you have similar educational biases.
- zogrodea 3y ago
  What's your point? With the sentence you quoted, I was expressing doubt that someone would be fired by Instagram for deliberately mistranslating that. (A different company wouldn't get the same assessment.)
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
matteoraso 3y ago
>2. The Arabic words for "Praise God" have already been made fun of a lot and acquired different connotations by English speakers (like associating those words with a terrorist who is about to bomb some place) so, again, doesn't seem inconsistent. You're probably thinking of "Allahu Akbar". What the Instagram user wrote was "alhamdulillah", which isn't something that you hear everyday outside of a Muslim-majority country.