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I don't get why people still use XPaths, CSS selectors or HTML IDs to identify elements, even when they are "recorded". Please please please just use my https:/

I don't get why people still use XPaths, CSS selectors or HTML IDs to identify elements, even when they are "recorded". Please please please just use my https://github.com/mherrmann/selenium-python-helium https://github.com/mherrmann/selenium-python-helium instead. It makes so much more sense.

potamic 3y ago
Why wouldn't you use CSS selectors? They are unambiguous, concise and most importantly, a standard. They should be the conventional way to refer to elements.
- mherrmann 3y ago
  The CSS structure of a web site is an implementation detail and on a global average, CSS selectors break much more often than user-visible labels.
- monkpit 3y ago
  > and most importantly, a standard. A standard for what, exactly? Selecting HTML elements? You could say the same about XPath. Both are implementation details tightly coupled to the code instead of being driven by the “human” elements of the UI, such as the visible text, labels, etc.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- bdcravens 3y ago
  The CSS selector isn't the problem, it's how you identify it. Many sites have dynamically named selectors, including class names. Even depending on ordering is fraught. Learning how to create robust selectors is about 1/2 the battle in writing a good Selenium/Puppeteer/Playwright/etc script. (been doing this as a major part of my day job for about 14 years)
abdusco 3y ago
Playwright is another, really good alternative
- bdcravens 3y ago
  It is, but the selector issues are the same. (though it does make it much easier to execute scripts in the context of the page when standard selectors don't work)
  - tmerse 3y ago
    It is, but the selector issues are the same I disagree. Playwright's locators are pretty powerful compared to standard css/xpath selectors. For example it includes layout based selectors. https://playwright.dev/docs/other-locators#css-matching-elements-based-on-layout https://playwright.dev/docs/other-locators#css-matching-elem...
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
monkpit 3y ago
This is the idea behind Testing-Library from what I understand. https://testing-library.com/ https://testing-library.com/
shmoogy 3y ago
I haven't found anything that made me really need to try other things, but the fact that it's just a wrapper and sounds like it handles nested iframes better means I'm trying this next time I need to make a quick selenium script. Thank you
alexirobbins 3y ago
Helium seems great! Handling popups sounds really clever, how do you pull that off?
sigg3 3y ago
This looks great, thanks
antman 3y ago
Let me have the opportunity to really thank you for this it has been my goto library for scraping, while allowing also selenium syntax, the idea behind it is really great. Also the “elements below …” very nice Please make the switch to selenium 4, so that it is kept up to date with the rest of the selenium ecosystem e.g. undetectable browsers

potamic 3y ago

Why wouldn't you use CSS selectors? They are unambiguous, concise and most importantly, a standard. They should be the conventional way to refer to elements.

mherrmann 3y ago
The CSS structure of a web site is an implementation detail and on a global average, CSS selectors break much more often than user-visible labels.
monkpit 3y ago
> and most importantly, a standard. A standard for what, exactly? Selecting HTML elements? You could say the same about XPath. Both are implementation details tightly coupled to the code instead of being driven by the “human” elements of the UI, such as the visible text, labels, etc.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
bdcravens 3y ago
The CSS selector isn't the problem, it's how you identify it. Many sites have dynamically named selectors, including class names. Even depending on ordering is fraught. Learning how to create robust selectors is about 1/2 the battle in writing a good Selenium/Puppeteer/Playwright/etc script. (been doing this as a major part of my day job for about 14 years)

abdusco 3y ago

Playwright is another, really good alternative

bdcravens 3y ago
It is, but the selector issues are the same. (though it does make it much easier to execute scripts in the context of the page when standard selectors don't work)
- tmerse 3y ago
  It is, but the selector issues are the same I disagree. Playwright's locators are pretty powerful compared to standard css/xpath selectors. For example it includes layout based selectors. https://playwright.dev/docs/other-locators#css-matching-elements-based-on-layout https://playwright.dev/docs/other-locators#css-matching-elem...

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

monkpit 3y ago

This is the idea behind Testing-Library from what I understand. https://testing-library.com/ https://testing-library.com/

shmoogy 3y ago

I haven't found anything that made me really need to try other things, but the fact that it's just a wrapper and sounds like it handles nested iframes better means I'm trying this next time I need to make a quick selenium script. Thank you

alexirobbins 3y ago

Helium seems great! Handling popups sounds really clever, how do you pull that off?

sigg3 3y ago

This looks great, thanks

antman 3y ago

Let me have the opportunity to really thank you for this it has been my goto library for scraping, while allowing also selenium syntax, the idea behind it is really great. Also the “elements below …” very nice Please make the switch to selenium 4, so that it is kept up to date with the rest of the selenium ecosystem e.g. undetectable browsers