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Attacking a person's worldview is in fact attacking the person, not the arguments. The arguments being inextricably linked in Marinetti's head does not impact t

Attacking a person's worldview is in fact attacking the person, not the arguments. The arguments being inextricably linked in Marinetti's head does not impact their validity outside his head.

AnimalMuppet 3y ago
As others have pointed out, even the futurist manifesto is highly problematic. That's what's outside his head - his arguments. And it's arguments that Andreessen is endorsing. So no, this is not an ad hominem.
surgical_fire 3y ago
Absolutely not, when we are discussing the philosophical basis of that worldview. Those arguments are not simply "linked in Marinetti's head". they are parts of a broader ser of views that would organize the world in a certain manner. This is brought up due to an apparent endorsement of the author to Marinetti's ideas. Commenters pointing that out is absolutely not an Ad Hominem when those very ideas are being discussed. I don't remember if there's an informal fallacy of falsely claiming an informal fallacy, but calling this an Ad Hominem is a great example of such.
- fastball 3y ago
  The ideas are not being discussed. The primary criticism in the OP was "Marinetti was fascist so ignore".
  - chx 3y ago
    I am happy to repeat myself: "should give you a new angle to investigate this bullshit from". That's not "ignore this".
    - chx 3y ago
      To elaborate a little, this thinkpiece will likely influence way more people than it should therefore understanding how it covertly spreads fascist ideas is important. Ignoring it doesn't make it go away.
chx 3y ago
Once again: I have called for investigating the influence of fascist ideas on this manifesto because the manifesto itself names one of the architects of it a saint. It doesn't matter at all who wrote this, we are only looking at the manifesto. On another hand, trying to paint futurism and fascism as completely separate falls flat because already the Futurist Manifesto contained some ideas from fascism and besides Marinetti, Carlo Carrà and many more also became an ardest supporter of fascism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortunato_Depero https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortunato_Depero notes > In the 1930s and 40s Depero continued working, although due to futurism being linked with fascism, the movement started to wane In https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism > Many Italian Futurists supported Fascism [...] The Futurists' association with Fascism after its triumph in 1922 brought them official acceptance in Italy It's not like I am trying to mash the two together only now, no, they were already together back then.

Attacking a person's worldview is in fact attacking the person, not the arguments. The arguments being inextricably linked in Marinetti's head does not impact their validity outside his head.

AnimalMuppet 3y ago

As others have pointed out, even the futurist manifesto is highly problematic. That's what's outside his head - his arguments. And it's arguments that Andreessen is endorsing. So no, this is not an ad hominem.

surgical_fire 3y ago

Absolutely not, when we are discussing the philosophical basis of that worldview. Those arguments are not simply "linked in Marinetti's head". they are parts of a broader ser of views that would organize the world in a certain manner. This is brought up due to an apparent endorsement of the author to Marinetti's ideas. Commenters pointing that out is absolutely not an Ad Hominem when those very ideas are being discussed. I don't remember if there's an informal fallacy of falsely claiming an informal fallacy, but calling this an Ad Hominem is a great example of such.

fastball 3y ago
The ideas are not being discussed. The primary criticism in the OP was "Marinetti was fascist so ignore".
- chx 3y ago
  I am happy to repeat myself: "should give you a new angle to investigate this bullshit from". That's not "ignore this".
  - chx 3y ago
    To elaborate a little, this thinkpiece will likely influence way more people than it should therefore understanding how it covertly spreads fascist ideas is important. Ignoring it doesn't make it go away.

chx 3y ago

Once again: I have called for investigating the influence of fascist ideas on this manifesto because the manifesto itself names one of the architects of it a saint. It doesn't matter at all who wrote this, we are only looking at the manifesto. On another hand, trying to paint futurism and fascism as completely separate falls flat because already the Futurist Manifesto contained some ideas from fascism and besides Marinetti, Carlo Carrà and many more also became an ardest supporter of fascism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortunato_Depero https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortunato_Depero notes > In the 1930s and 40s Depero continued working, although due to futurism being linked with fascism, the movement started to wane In https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism > Many Italian Futurists supported Fascism [...] The Futurists' association with Fascism after its triumph in 1922 brought them official acceptance in Italy It's not like I am trying to mash the two together only now, no, they were already together back then.