4 ms·

I understand what you mean, and after several tours of duty across FAANGs and startups I think the bouncing-around tends to me less of an individual characteris

I understand what you mean, and after several tours of duty across FAANGs and startups I think the bouncing-around tends to me less of an individual characteristic and more of a symptom of organizational dysfunction. For startups, the landscape within a given role tends to vary drastically year over year. Some folks like being employee #10 but don't want to hang around past employee #20. Other folks like being employee #1000 but out of 2000 or 3000 feel overwhelmed. Organizations these days hire, especially where employment is at-will, with the expectation that their staff are fungible (they're not) and can be rearranged at the drop of a hat (which happens often). One project can be a blast, and if the next one isn't then the grass is indeed often greener on the other side -- at least in our industry. Some of my best hires have been folks who have never stuck around at previous places for more than 6-9 months over the course of several years. On the whole, it's all a total crapshoot.

verelo 3y ago
Your last sentence for me is it: total crapshoot. Agreed, it’s so hard to tell. I try hire more for personality and general intelligence and assume we can teach process and new tools. Historically I’ve attempted to tell developers what you said upfront, that some projects will suck but I’ll do my best to make sure you’re not always on the sucky work. I think managers often forget that cycling people in and out of fun roles is important for retention, just as is pay etc. There is some value in expectation setting around “I’m not going to abandon you in the shit forever, but at times you’ll be in the shit and so will i, and i appreciate you sticking with me and will do everything i can to reward that” Ted Lasso kinda stuff…but it’s not all worthless even if it doesn’t work 100% of the time.
- xyzzy_plugh 3y ago
  I have definitely noticed that fewer and fewer managers are fostering that type of relationship with their team. Seems like managers are doing the same, and hopping from ship to ship. I've recently seen some managers totally throw folks under the bus -- otherwise very good folks too. But otherwise I agree. The market has been quick to hire and fire which makes building and retaining talent difficult. The instability of the last several years has really left things in a seemingly universal bad state.
  - verelo 3y ago
    That’s a good point. I guess this is just how it goes right now. I’ve found that retaining members on a team is the best hack for high performance. You need management bought into paying them well and giving you some autonomy around HR processes and what you work on, but if you can do it i believe the returns are real.

verelo 3y ago

Your last sentence for me is it: total crapshoot. Agreed, it’s so hard to tell. I try hire more for personality and general intelligence and assume we can teach process and new tools. Historically I’ve attempted to tell developers what you said upfront, that some projects will suck but I’ll do my best to make sure you’re not always on the sucky work. I think managers often forget that cycling people in and out of fun roles is important for retention, just as is pay etc. There is some value in expectation setting around “I’m not going to abandon you in the shit forever, but at times you’ll be in the shit and so will i, and i appreciate you sticking with me and will do everything i can to reward that” Ted Lasso kinda stuff…but it’s not all worthless even if it doesn’t work 100% of the time.

xyzzy_plugh 3y ago
I have definitely noticed that fewer and fewer managers are fostering that type of relationship with their team. Seems like managers are doing the same, and hopping from ship to ship. I've recently seen some managers totally throw folks under the bus -- otherwise very good folks too. But otherwise I agree. The market has been quick to hire and fire which makes building and retaining talent difficult. The instability of the last several years has really left things in a seemingly universal bad state.
- verelo 3y ago
  That’s a good point. I guess this is just how it goes right now. I’ve found that retaining members on a team is the best hack for high performance. You need management bought into paying them well and giving you some autonomy around HR processes and what you work on, but if you can do it i believe the returns are real.