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> Affront society is described as being "a never-ending, self-perpetuating holocaust of pain and misery", where the strong prey upon weaker species and individu

> Affront society is described as being "a never-ending, self-perpetuating holocaust of pain and misery", where the strong prey upon weaker species and individuals. > Among the Affront's technological accomplishments is an aptitude for genetic engineering, which they developed long before spaceflight. They use this skill almost exclusively on 'prey species', which tend to be changed so as to provide greater sport (and opportunity for sadism) during the communal hunts forming a major part of the Affront culture. > One of the few changes to their own species was the redesign of their females to make sex painful for them > "a never-ending, self-perpetuating holocaust of pain and misery" I'm curious: do you honestly believe the Affront are cool?

hoseja 3y ago
Suffering isn't actually wrong by some law of physics, it's just immoral when your morality is slave morality and your highest aspiration is safety and your most important motivator, fear. Affronters are just more alive, more vital, actually trying, actually risking things; than the Culture HR department drones (heh), as comprehended by the ambassador, but it's still weird because the ambassador's actions are viewed from the confused uncomprehending PC perspective throughout the book.
- GeoAtreides 3y ago
  Boss, put the Nietzsche down, not sure you're handling it right. Hurting other sentients, just because you're sadistic and/or sociopathic, is bad. There's nothing vital in genetically modifying women to feel only pain when having sex... unless you disagree?
rsynnott 3y ago
The Culture diplomat in the book does. Though it's fairly clear that he's one of the Culture's broken people, who do tend to end up in Contact/SC. They're abhorrent, obviously, but one of Banks' better examples of an alien morality. He wasn't really great at this in general; most of his other villains are some variant of evil empire/evil capitalist, or occasional ineffable great-old-one-style evil. For weird aliens (though little else), try Peter F Hamilton.
- GeoAtreides 3y ago
  I disagree they're an example of alien morality. They're clearly sadistic, enjoying the suffering of others because they suffer and knowing that's a bad thing.

hoseja 3y ago

Suffering isn't actually wrong by some law of physics, it's just immoral when your morality is slave morality and your highest aspiration is safety and your most important motivator, fear. Affronters are just more alive, more vital, actually trying, actually risking things; than the Culture HR department drones (heh), as comprehended by the ambassador, but it's still weird because the ambassador's actions are viewed from the confused uncomprehending PC perspective throughout the book.

GeoAtreides 3y ago
Boss, put the Nietzsche down, not sure you're handling it right. Hurting other sentients, just because you're sadistic and/or sociopathic, is bad. There's nothing vital in genetically modifying women to feel only pain when having sex... unless you disagree?

rsynnott 3y ago

The Culture diplomat in the book does. Though it's fairly clear that he's one of the Culture's broken people, who do tend to end up in Contact/SC. They're abhorrent, obviously, but one of Banks' better examples of an alien morality. He wasn't really great at this in general; most of his other villains are some variant of evil empire/evil capitalist, or occasional ineffable great-old-one-style evil. For weird aliens (though little else), try Peter F Hamilton.

GeoAtreides 3y ago
I disagree they're an example of alien morality. They're clearly sadistic, enjoying the suffering of others because they suffer and knowing that's a bad thing.