4 ms·

NASCAR has single lug per wheel now.

by rascul 3y ago

aidenn0 3y ago
Wow, I hadn't watched in a while. They apparently allow fuel-injection now too (NASCAR used carburetors through 2012!)
- ok_dad 3y ago
  This isn’t your father’s NASCAR! THEY EVEN RACED ON DIRT AGAIN! One of the cars was even entered in 24h of Le Mans (garage56) and did pretty well. It’s actually pretty cool how they’re transforming it into something a bit more than driving around in a circle for hours.
  - nemo44x 3y ago
    > It’s actually pretty cool how they’re transforming it into something a bit more than driving around in a circle for hours. Although I think it’s great to see dirt races (I grew up watching late model dirt tracks) I disagree that the super speedways are just driving around in a circle. One of the major factors of NASCAR was that the engines were built and tuned by the crew and the driver had to be able to push it to the limits over an extended period of time. Mistuning and/or too aggressive driving would blow the engine. The really good drivers knew when to push it over the edge for just a few moments to get advantage.
    - ddoolin 3y ago
      I think once you're trying to explain that nuance, most of the audience (that NASCAR would like to tune in) has probably already tuned out. It is very welcome for them to start pivoting heavily towards road courses, dirt courses, and even street races (not to mention wet weather tires), as it opens up the field to WAY more driver skill sets and strategy than just tire falloff, fuel, and gaming restarts.
      - nemo44x 3y ago
        Indeed. For me just the sound and the speed is enough but that doesn’t translate to TV well. NASCAR is a funny sport in that it was built around a particular technology around a particular time. The level of innovation the mechanics came up with really drive the sport. But the ICE is in many ways at end of life and it’s obvious they’ll be extinct in 30 years. So I suppose the sport has to evolve itself somehow.
  - 1970-01-01 3y ago
    Seems like they could go all the way back to their roots and race actual stock cars.
    - olyjohn 3y ago
      If you go back to their roots, they weren't racing sports cars, but regular sedans and coupes. In this day and age, that means they'd be racing around in a bunch of crossovers with CVTs. Oh an no safety equipment like roll cages, harnesses, fire suppression, etc. Racing a stock Mustang or Camaro or Supra isn't really NASCAR roots either. I think they miss the spirit of what a stock car is. Unless we start building regular coupes and sedans again, I don't think we can go back. Here's an interesting timeline of NASCAR stock cars. Pretty much the latest gen cars are the only ones that buck the trend. https://www.nascar.com/gallery/the-evolution-of-nascar-sprint-cup-cars/ https://www.nascar.com/gallery/the-evolution-of-nascar-sprin... However, If you want some racing with actual stock-ish cars, you should check out the SCCA runoffs on YouTube. There are classes for just about everything you can think of, and the coverage is actually pretty good!
      - aidenn0 3y ago
        Just looking at that list the early-50s Hornet was pretty muscle-y as far as cars go with its 5.0L straight-six, though it was also a legitimate luxury sedan. Maybe closer a Taycan or something for a modern day equivalent? Though that's in a different price-class than the Hornet was. Is there a tuned luxury car for under $60k today?
  - DiggyJohnson 3y ago
    If you’re familiar enough with NASCAR to know this much about the goings on of this season, I’m surprised you have this perspective on oval pack racing. To say it’s just driving around in a circle is missing so much. Instead of writing an essay, I’ll just make the claim that it’s like saying that writing software is just typing on a keyboard for a few hours. Yes there’s certainly more randomness / chaos in oval racing, but it’s certainly not brain dead or simple. Pack racing is also unique across nearly all motorsport disciplines (I’m a bit of a motor sports addict). There’s certainly things to criticize about NASCAR like there is for all forms of organized competition, but the meme that NASCAR is silly because they “just turn left” is extremely closed minded. Is soccer just kicking a ball around until the other team screws up? Sorry for the tone, I don’t really mean to direct it at you personally, but more so at the prevalence of this meme. If it was true then stock car oval racing wouldn’t be a thing, it’s simple as that.
    - ok_dad 3y ago
      I don’t simrace much on ovals but it is challenging. I prefer road courses, I’m not much into the tactics of racing, which is a large part of ovals. Don’t get triggered too hard, it was mostly a joke :)
    - pradn 3y ago
      I am curious, why exactly is it so much more than turning left? Is it minute adjustments like in curling?
      - ok_dad 3y ago
        From a drivers view an oval race is you trying to perfect your arc around the big curves to lose very little speed, while also trying to gain advantage when an opponent makes mistakes. Your ability to deviate from the perfect line is limited. There is a large amount of strategy before and during the race to perfect your car’s tuning, plan fuel and tire strategies, and respond to caution flags since that gives some additional ability to refuel or whatever and maybe be able to use it to your advantage. Road course racing has all that stuff but it’s also a bit more down to driver skill and less of strategy, IMO. You can drive much more varied in most road racing and still gain advantage versus another opponent who might be technically more perfect or have a slightly better car.
- rascul 3y ago
  Also independent rear suspension and a sequential gearbox now.
- interestica 3y ago
  Not a car guy. What's the advantage of fuel injection and why did they stick with it so long?
  - pests 3y ago
    Fuel injection is electrically and computer controlled while carburetors rely on air pressure changes and is completely mechanical. Why did they stick with carbs for so long? Lots of reasons but a few: Fuel injectors allow for more power so giving every car a boost was a delibrate decision - NASCAR already has other speed-reducing technology on purpose. Switching also meant every team spending millions and redesigning their entire engine to take advantage of the new tech. Carbs had ossified so teams were pretty level on this front indepenent of money so switching also would give teams with money money a bigger advantage.
  - aidenn0 3y ago
    First why they stuck fuel injection (FI) for so long: They banned FI after the 1957 Chevy came out with it (FI was not standard in the '57, but enough were produced with FI to qualify as "stock") and dominated NASCAR. One should note that even with a carburetor, the '57 was really good. They kept the ban for tradition I think more than anything else. When the banned FI, it was still rather exotic, but by the 90s, essentially all new mass-market cars were fuel injected. Carburetors are rather finicky; they rely on basic physics to maintain a proper fuel-air mixture and doing so over a wide range of temperatures and RPMs is hard. Since fuel-injectors are electronically controlled you can do a lot more with them, so they can maximize power and fuel-economy over a broader environmental range.

NASCAR has single lug per wheel now.

by rascul 3y ago

NASCAR has single lug per wheel now.

aidenn0 3y ago

Wow, I hadn't watched in a while. They apparently allow fuel-injection now too (NASCAR used carburetors through 2012!)

ok_dad 3y ago
This isn’t your father’s NASCAR! THEY EVEN RACED ON DIRT AGAIN! One of the cars was even entered in 24h of Le Mans (garage56) and did pretty well. It’s actually pretty cool how they’re transforming it into something a bit more than driving around in a circle for hours.
- nemo44x 3y ago
  > It’s actually pretty cool how they’re transforming it into something a bit more than driving around in a circle for hours. Although I think it’s great to see dirt races (I grew up watching late model dirt tracks) I disagree that the super speedways are just driving around in a circle. One of the major factors of NASCAR was that the engines were built and tuned by the crew and the driver had to be able to push it to the limits over an extended period of time. Mistuning and/or too aggressive driving would blow the engine. The really good drivers knew when to push it over the edge for just a few moments to get advantage.
  - ddoolin 3y ago
    I think once you're trying to explain that nuance, most of the audience (that NASCAR would like to tune in) has probably already tuned out. It is very welcome for them to start pivoting heavily towards road courses, dirt courses, and even street races (not to mention wet weather tires), as it opens up the field to WAY more driver skill sets and strategy than just tire falloff, fuel, and gaming restarts.
    - nemo44x 3y ago
      Indeed. For me just the sound and the speed is enough but that doesn’t translate to TV well. NASCAR is a funny sport in that it was built around a particular technology around a particular time. The level of innovation the mechanics came up with really drive the sport. But the ICE is in many ways at end of life and it’s obvious they’ll be extinct in 30 years. So I suppose the sport has to evolve itself somehow.
- 1970-01-01 3y ago
  Seems like they could go all the way back to their roots and race actual stock cars.
  - olyjohn 3y ago
    If you go back to their roots, they weren't racing sports cars, but regular sedans and coupes. In this day and age, that means they'd be racing around in a bunch of crossovers with CVTs. Oh an no safety equipment like roll cages, harnesses, fire suppression, etc. Racing a stock Mustang or Camaro or Supra isn't really NASCAR roots either. I think they miss the spirit of what a stock car is. Unless we start building regular coupes and sedans again, I don't think we can go back. Here's an interesting timeline of NASCAR stock cars. Pretty much the latest gen cars are the only ones that buck the trend. https://www.nascar.com/gallery/the-evolution-of-nascar-sprint-cup-cars/ https://www.nascar.com/gallery/the-evolution-of-nascar-sprin... However, If you want some racing with actual stock-ish cars, you should check out the SCCA runoffs on YouTube. There are classes for just about everything you can think of, and the coverage is actually pretty good!
    - aidenn0 3y ago
      Just looking at that list the early-50s Hornet was pretty muscle-y as far as cars go with its 5.0L straight-six, though it was also a legitimate luxury sedan. Maybe closer a Taycan or something for a modern day equivalent? Though that's in a different price-class than the Hornet was. Is there a tuned luxury car for under $60k today?
- DiggyJohnson 3y ago
  If you’re familiar enough with NASCAR to know this much about the goings on of this season, I’m surprised you have this perspective on oval pack racing. To say it’s just driving around in a circle is missing so much. Instead of writing an essay, I’ll just make the claim that it’s like saying that writing software is just typing on a keyboard for a few hours. Yes there’s certainly more randomness / chaos in oval racing, but it’s certainly not brain dead or simple. Pack racing is also unique across nearly all motorsport disciplines (I’m a bit of a motor sports addict). There’s certainly things to criticize about NASCAR like there is for all forms of organized competition, but the meme that NASCAR is silly because they “just turn left” is extremely closed minded. Is soccer just kicking a ball around until the other team screws up? Sorry for the tone, I don’t really mean to direct it at you personally, but more so at the prevalence of this meme. If it was true then stock car oval racing wouldn’t be a thing, it’s simple as that.
  - ok_dad 3y ago
    I don’t simrace much on ovals but it is challenging. I prefer road courses, I’m not much into the tactics of racing, which is a large part of ovals. Don’t get triggered too hard, it was mostly a joke :)
  - pradn 3y ago
    I am curious, why exactly is it so much more than turning left? Is it minute adjustments like in curling?
    - ok_dad 3y ago
      From a drivers view an oval race is you trying to perfect your arc around the big curves to lose very little speed, while also trying to gain advantage when an opponent makes mistakes. Your ability to deviate from the perfect line is limited. There is a large amount of strategy before and during the race to perfect your car’s tuning, plan fuel and tire strategies, and respond to caution flags since that gives some additional ability to refuel or whatever and maybe be able to use it to your advantage. Road course racing has all that stuff but it’s also a bit more down to driver skill and less of strategy, IMO. You can drive much more varied in most road racing and still gain advantage versus another opponent who might be technically more perfect or have a slightly better car.
rascul 3y ago
Also independent rear suspension and a sequential gearbox now.
interestica 3y ago
Not a car guy. What's the advantage of fuel injection and why did they stick with it so long?
- pests 3y ago
  Fuel injection is electrically and computer controlled while carburetors rely on air pressure changes and is completely mechanical. Why did they stick with carbs for so long? Lots of reasons but a few: Fuel injectors allow for more power so giving every car a boost was a delibrate decision - NASCAR already has other speed-reducing technology on purpose. Switching also meant every team spending millions and redesigning their entire engine to take advantage of the new tech. Carbs had ossified so teams were pretty level on this front indepenent of money so switching also would give teams with money money a bigger advantage.
- aidenn0 3y ago
  First why they stuck fuel injection (FI) for so long: They banned FI after the 1957 Chevy came out with it (FI was not standard in the '57, but enough were produced with FI to qualify as "stock") and dominated NASCAR. One should note that even with a carburetor, the '57 was really good. They kept the ban for tradition I think more than anything else. When the banned FI, it was still rather exotic, but by the 90s, essentially all new mass-market cars were fuel injected. Carburetors are rather finicky; they rely on basic physics to maintain a proper fuel-air mixture and doing so over a wide range of temperatures and RPMs is hard. Since fuel-injectors are electronically controlled you can do a lot more with them, so they can maximize power and fuel-economy over a broader environmental range.