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How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd uses run-by-someone-else models so cheerfully and carelessly? You do realize any data sent to MS/openai/anyone wi

How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd uses run-by-someone-else models so cheerfully and carelessly? You do realize any data sent to MS/openai/anyone will be stored forever and probably be used against you in the (near) future?

thsksbd 3y ago
Todays HN is as interesting as it was back in 2011. But it is not privacy minded like it once was (was it ever?) at all.
yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago
Are you sure it's the same people? That said, even if it is, there's something to be said for intentionally sharing a constrained set of code vs using something that spies on you in real life.
- cabirum 3y ago
  Could be different sets of people actually! However. It will eventually, chunk by chunk, upload the full source code of the app you are writing. Complete with all typos and mis-pastes. Like youtube blocks videos with just a hint of copyrighted music, they may be able to detect use of "patented" algos or something like that and block you/ send a lawyer/etc.
  - weikju 3y ago
    > upload the full source code of the app you are writing The full code that’s already uploaded via “git push”?
    - cabirum 3y ago
      ... via git push to a trusted origin, which is not github.
      - yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago
        I suppose it happens, but I suspect the set of people who distrust github/MS enough to not use them for git hosting but still use copilot is quite small.
    - macinjosh 3y ago
      Inded, some folks are so worried about their code being sucked up by an AI bot they forget they ship every single revision and byte to MS via github. If MS wanted to be devious with the data entrusted to them they could have done it already.
  - ilc 3y ago
    Intellectual property scanning using AI would be a service that they could charge for... For both sides.
jasonlotito 3y ago
> How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd HN has never been a privacy-minded crowd. It's been a collection of random people, and depending on the threads of topic, you'll get more people speaking out than others. See the Dropbox post from 2007. Nary a privacy concern. HN isn't a single voice. Why do you think it's a privacy-minded crowd? Because you probably react and respond to similar posts, and you see people with a like-mind there. > How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd uses run-by-someone-else models so cheerfully and carelessly? Let's answer this question: they probably aren't doing it carelessly. Consider that Copilot is run by Microsoft, who owns GitHub and your code already. So, they already have the code. I'm not sending them something they don't already have. Anyways, when I see something I didn't expect to see on HN, my initial thought isn't how it's wrong, but rather, what am I missing? And rather than post an antagonistic question, I instead try to research more to get a better understanding of what I'm missing.
- cabirum 3y ago
  My own code is on my own gitea instance in my home, exposed via a cheap jump server. My companys code is stored on-premise. Nothing touches github and no, ms does not already have my code.
  - mfitton 3y ago
    I'd say your set-up is probably more rare than people whose own code and whose company code are both stored on Github.
pjc50 3y ago
Indeed. Our company looked at the IP issues and issued a very strong "do not put any company IP in an AI" edict. Have you double-checked the terms of service? Are you absolutely certain that there's no risk of your copilot use impairing your intellectual property rights in the future? Given what happened to Unity, how comfortable are you with becoming dependent on copilot and then having the rules change underneath you?
rsynnott 3y ago
HN's privacy-minded crowd and HN's AI-obsessed crowd don't have much crossover, I don't think.
- esafak 3y ago
  I bet there is an age gap; the former are older than the latter.

thsksbd 3y ago

Todays HN is as interesting as it was back in 2011. But it is not privacy minded like it once was (was it ever?) at all.

yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago

Are you sure it's the same people? That said, even if it is, there's something to be said for intentionally sharing a constrained set of code vs using something that spies on you in real life.

cabirum 3y ago
Could be different sets of people actually! However. It will eventually, chunk by chunk, upload the full source code of the app you are writing. Complete with all typos and mis-pastes. Like youtube blocks videos with just a hint of copyrighted music, they may be able to detect use of "patented" algos or something like that and block you/ send a lawyer/etc.
- weikju 3y ago
  > upload the full source code of the app you are writing The full code that’s already uploaded via “git push”?
  - cabirum 3y ago
    ... via git push to a trusted origin, which is not github.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago
      I suppose it happens, but I suspect the set of people who distrust github/MS enough to not use them for git hosting but still use copilot is quite small.
  - macinjosh 3y ago
    Inded, some folks are so worried about their code being sucked up by an AI bot they forget they ship every single revision and byte to MS via github. If MS wanted to be devious with the data entrusted to them they could have done it already.
- ilc 3y ago
  Intellectual property scanning using AI would be a service that they could charge for... For both sides.

jasonlotito 3y ago

> How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd HN has never been a privacy-minded crowd. It's been a collection of random people, and depending on the threads of topic, you'll get more people speaking out than others. See the Dropbox post from 2007. Nary a privacy concern. HN isn't a single voice. Why do you think it's a privacy-minded crowd? Because you probably react and respond to similar posts, and you see people with a like-mind there. > How came that usually privacy-minded hn crowd uses run-by-someone-else models so cheerfully and carelessly? Let's answer this question: they probably aren't doing it carelessly. Consider that Copilot is run by Microsoft, who owns GitHub and your code already. So, they already have the code. I'm not sending them something they don't already have. Anyways, when I see something I didn't expect to see on HN, my initial thought isn't how it's wrong, but rather, what am I missing? And rather than post an antagonistic question, I instead try to research more to get a better understanding of what I'm missing.

cabirum 3y ago
My own code is on my own gitea instance in my home, exposed via a cheap jump server. My companys code is stored on-premise. Nothing touches github and no, ms does not already have my code.
- mfitton 3y ago
  I'd say your set-up is probably more rare than people whose own code and whose company code are both stored on Github.

pjc50 3y ago

Indeed. Our company looked at the IP issues and issued a very strong "do not put any company IP in an AI" edict. Have you double-checked the terms of service? Are you absolutely certain that there's no risk of your copilot use impairing your intellectual property rights in the future? Given what happened to Unity, how comfortable are you with becoming dependent on copilot and then having the rules change underneath you?

rsynnott 3y ago

HN's privacy-minded crowd and HN's AI-obsessed crowd don't have much crossover, I don't think.

esafak 3y ago
I bet there is an age gap; the former are older than the latter.