5 ms·

I gave Wayfire a shot a bit earlier in the year, but as I am a Dvorak typist and <https://github.com/WayfireWM/wayfire/issues/1601 https://github.com/WayfireWM/

by tmtvl 3y ago

I gave Wayfire a shot a bit earlier in the year, but as I am a Dvorak typist and <https://github.com/WayfireWM/wayfire/issues/1601 https://github.com/WayfireWM/wayfire/issues/1601> is marked as "wontfix", I decided to stick to Awesome for the time being. It did run like a dream, though, even on my ancient potato, so if the keybinding issue does get fixed at some point I may well switch over.

toastal 3y ago
Oof. That is not an acceptable way to treat the issue. It’s one thing to say you don’t the time & cycles, but it’s another to WONTFIX it twice with a clear usability problem.
- Vinnl 3y ago
  It seems fine to me. They don't want to update it, so they close the issue. They're under no obligation (not even a moral one) to change their plans, and everyone's free to fork it to implement their own plans.
  - pxc 3y ago
    They seem interested in user feedback and genuinely curious about the use cases of others, though, as evinced by their activity here. Seems like a great time to politely make a case for one's preference, given the new attention and interest. :)
    - Vinnl 3y ago
      Even better :) Either way nothing to be mad at them about.
- ammen99 3y ago
  As the maintainer of Wayfire, I would like to say why I don't consider this a critical issue: the current system allows you to bind actions to a particular physical key. So, no matter what physical keyboard layout and actual layout in software, with the current system, you can bind the action to the desired physical key. Or do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts?
  - toastal 3y ago
    I edit in Vim using Dvorak. I always expect `ciw` to “change inner word” regardless of layout. Most shortcuts are stored in my head in this way, not by physical key placement. That said, it doesn’t bother me that xmonad sets up my keys based on the default layout, so if I switch to another to type in a non-Latin script, the WMs shortcuts stay bound to my ‘normal’ keymap as the others are only used temporarily.
  - malermeister 3y ago
    > do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts? As a colemak user, definitely. It's a super weird and confusing experience otherwise and this bug is a blocker for me checking out your (otherwise quite promising-looking) project.
    - ammen99 3y ago
      Wait, so you use both colemak and the normal qwerty layout and switch between them on the same keyboard? As a vim user, I am hugely relying on muscle memory - which is why saying that bindings should vary between layouts seems really weird, as that would make muscle memory way less effective. Then again, that is my usage ..
      - malermeister 3y ago
        It's kind of hard to explain, but I think my brain doesn't go "letter -> key on keyboard", it goes "letter -> location in keyboard layout -> key on keyboard". If the key on keyboard stays the same, even though the layout changes, it really messes with the way my brain maps from letters to muscle movements, idk if this makes sense.
  - codetrotter 3y ago
    > do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts? Personally, yes. If I am in Qwerty and I press the T key, I press the button where T is physically in Qwerty. If I am in Dvorak, I press the button where T is physically in Dvorak. Pressing the button where something is physically in Qwerty when I am in another layout would be very confusing, because effectively it would be that everything else is respecting the layout I am using except this one program that is still using the Qwerty positions of the keys.
notRobot 3y ago
Since the last comment in that thread says there might be some progress at the time of the 0.8.0 announcement, it might be worth asking for an update.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
phkahler 3y ago
>> It did run like a dream, though, even on my ancient potato I believe this is the compositor they're going to run on Raspberry Pi 4 and 5 with the next OS release, so it makes sense it will run on more limited hardware.

by tmtvl 3y ago

toastal 3y ago

Oof. That is not an acceptable way to treat the issue. It’s one thing to say you don’t the time & cycles, but it’s another to WONTFIX it twice with a clear usability problem.

Vinnl 3y ago
It seems fine to me. They don't want to update it, so they close the issue. They're under no obligation (not even a moral one) to change their plans, and everyone's free to fork it to implement their own plans.
- pxc 3y ago
  They seem interested in user feedback and genuinely curious about the use cases of others, though, as evinced by their activity here. Seems like a great time to politely make a case for one's preference, given the new attention and interest. :)
  - Vinnl 3y ago
    Even better :) Either way nothing to be mad at them about.
ammen99 3y ago
As the maintainer of Wayfire, I would like to say why I don't consider this a critical issue: the current system allows you to bind actions to a particular physical key. So, no matter what physical keyboard layout and actual layout in software, with the current system, you can bind the action to the desired physical key. Or do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts?
- toastal 3y ago
  I edit in Vim using Dvorak. I always expect `ciw` to “change inner word” regardless of layout. Most shortcuts are stored in my head in this way, not by physical key placement. That said, it doesn’t bother me that xmonad sets up my keys based on the default layout, so if I switch to another to type in a non-Latin script, the WMs shortcuts stay bound to my ‘normal’ keymap as the others are only used temporarily.
- malermeister 3y ago
  > do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts? As a colemak user, definitely. It's a super weird and confusing experience otherwise and this bug is a blocker for me checking out your (otherwise quite promising-looking) project.
  - ammen99 3y ago
    Wait, so you use both colemak and the normal qwerty layout and switch between them on the same keyboard? As a vim user, I am hugely relying on muscle memory - which is why saying that bindings should vary between layouts seems really weird, as that would make muscle memory way less effective. Then again, that is my usage ..
    - malermeister 3y ago
      It's kind of hard to explain, but I think my brain doesn't go "letter -> key on keyboard", it goes "letter -> location in keyboard layout -> key on keyboard". If the key on keyboard stays the same, even though the layout changes, it really messes with the way my brain maps from letters to muscle movements, idk if this makes sense.
- codetrotter 3y ago
  > do people actually want their keybindings to change when they change their layouts? Personally, yes. If I am in Qwerty and I press the T key, I press the button where T is physically in Qwerty. If I am in Dvorak, I press the button where T is physically in Dvorak. Pressing the button where something is physically in Qwerty when I am in another layout would be very confusing, because effectively it would be that everything else is respecting the layout I am using except this one program that is still using the Qwerty positions of the keys.

notRobot 3y ago

Since the last comment in that thread says there might be some progress at the time of the 0.8.0 announcement, it might be worth asking for an update.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

phkahler 3y ago

>> It did run like a dream, though, even on my ancient potato I believe this is the compositor they're going to run on Raspberry Pi 4 and 5 with the next OS release, so it makes sense it will run on more limited hardware.