4 ms·

The good news is that the yellow card is for not resolving issues with the backup diesel power system, not anything to do with the reactor vessel or primary loo

The good news is that the yellow card is for not resolving issues with the backup diesel power system, not anything to do with the reactor vessel or primary loop. This is the right abundance of caution for the NRC to use (after all, that kind of reactor can melt down if power completely fails and cannot be maintained to sink heat), but it should be an easy fix. If anything, the yellow card was given for how long Dominion's been letting itself sit on an easy fix. (On the other hand, the justifiably-paranoid might ask what else is wrong if they've let a maintenance issue this relatively unimportant slide...)

ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago
This reminds me of the “Green M&Ms Canary” story; attributed to Van Halen. They were famous for having a clause in the preparation checklist, that they had to have a bowl of M&Ms in the lounge, but no green ones. Eddie Van Halen was asked about this, and his explanation was that their stage set was very complex, and required rigorous preparation. Failure could actually be dangerous (think the “pod” scene from Spinal Tap). He said that if they found green M&Ms, then that meant the instructions were not read correctly. [EDIT] I was wrong. It was brown M&Ms
- adaml_623 3y ago
  Brown M&Ms. Which is tiny I know but I have a suspicion you did that to test us
  - ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago
    No. It was my mistake. I didn't read the rider, so Dave would be stuck in a pod.
- dylan604 3y ago
  ahem...you clearly didn't read the rider. it was brown M&Ms "The rider's "Munchies" section was where the group made its candy-with-a-caveat request: "M&M's (WARNING: ABSOLUTELY NO BROWN ONES)." * *https://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/van-halens-legendary-mms-rider https://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/van-halens-leg...
  - ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago
    > you clearly didn't read the rider. You are correct, which is why I am not setting up metal stages.
- vsareto 3y ago
  It's cute, but it's a tattered and dirty band-aid compared to what you could do to ensure things were followed correctly. But the correct way costs way more money than M&Ms.
  - yamazakiwi 3y ago
    The M&M test is a tactic. It's not the only strategy you would employ if you were trying to solve the issues that Fukushima had and money wasn't relevant to how this solution helped Van Halen. Drawing interesting parallels makes for better conversation, I'm not sure anyone needed to be reminded of the differences between a Band's live show setup and Nuclear Power Plant safety. That being said... you would be surprised to learn how often "cute" tactics like these are utilized by governments to leverage human behavior.
  - pests 3y ago
    I think its a pretty good indicator. Like the anti-tip labels for shipping delicate things.
- trehalose 3y ago
  I don't really understand your metaphor. As you say, the M&Ms are just a proxy indicator. They indicate the instructions were read, but they have no direct role in the stage set. The backup diesel generators, at this nuclear power plant, could be considered a proxy indicator that attention has been paid to more fundamental pieces of the reactor, as your metaphor implies, sure. But the backup diesel generators themselves play a direct and critical role in the preventing a power outage from turning into a nuclear meltdown. Imagine if the M&Ms actually did act as a fire suppression system that would stop a pyrotechnics mishap from burning down the concert arena. That's more like the kind of M&Ms that were supposed to be in the bowl at this power plant.
christophilus 3y ago
> the justifiably-paranoid might ask what else is wrong if they've let a maintenance issue this relatively unimportant slide... Exactly. It seems like the kind of negligence that should get a license revoked and have the plant seized and handed over to a more competent manager (Duke seems reasonable). I wonder if there's precedence for such a move when it comes to utilities in the US? Edit: It doesn't seem quite as negligent after a second reading, but ... still makes me wonder what else has been done quickly and without really addressing the root issue...
- roenxi 3y ago
  What do you think happened here? To me it reads like there was an issue, the the issue was identified in a preemptive maintenance program and got fixed. The regulator's [0] complaint seems to be the operator may have been able to detect the problem sooner. The sounds acceptable. We're not able to run any piece of gear without the occasional failure - the argument with nuclear is a failure scenario appears to be about as damaging as the business-as-usual so all y'all be mad for putting so much effort into preventing it that nuclear became uneconomic. Uneconomic because finding and fixing a crack in a pipe in the backup system is 4-on-a-5-tier system of regulatory response and has people talking about delicensing the operator. [0] Oh wait I know this regulator. The dude who is in charge has a B. Arts in Religious Studies - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_T._Hanson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_T._Hanson - which isn't a problem in itself but I felt it was apart of a pattern when it came to heads of the regulator. Their backgrounds didn't inspire my confidence.
  - nikau 3y ago
    > We're not able to run any piece of gear without the occasional failure Seems like they could easily pressurize the pipes when idle to detect leaks
    - roenxi 3y ago
      Next time you stub your toe, reflect that you could have moved your foot differently and not stubbed it. And yet nobody called for you to be delicensed from anything, even though you were just less competent (I mean, seriously, when that day comes you'll have just fucked up walking!) and did more damage to your own body than SC nuclear plant was ever likely to do to anyone.

ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago

This reminds me of the “Green M&Ms Canary” story; attributed to Van Halen. They were famous for having a clause in the preparation checklist, that they had to have a bowl of M&Ms in the lounge, but no green ones. Eddie Van Halen was asked about this, and his explanation was that their stage set was very complex, and required rigorous preparation. Failure could actually be dangerous (think the “pod” scene from Spinal Tap). He said that if they found green M&Ms, then that meant the instructions were not read correctly. [EDIT] I was wrong. It was brown M&Ms

adaml_623 3y ago
Brown M&Ms. Which is tiny I know but I have a suspicion you did that to test us
- ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago
  No. It was my mistake. I didn't read the rider, so Dave would be stuck in a pod.
dylan604 3y ago
ahem...you clearly didn't read the rider. it was brown M&Ms "The rider's "Munchies" section was where the group made its candy-with-a-caveat request: "M&M's (WARNING: ABSOLUTELY NO BROWN ONES)." * *https://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/van-halens-legendary-mms-rider https://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/van-halens-leg...
- ChrisMarshallNY 3y ago
  > you clearly didn't read the rider. You are correct, which is why I am not setting up metal stages.
vsareto 3y ago
It's cute, but it's a tattered and dirty band-aid compared to what you could do to ensure things were followed correctly. But the correct way costs way more money than M&Ms.
- yamazakiwi 3y ago
  The M&M test is a tactic. It's not the only strategy you would employ if you were trying to solve the issues that Fukushima had and money wasn't relevant to how this solution helped Van Halen. Drawing interesting parallels makes for better conversation, I'm not sure anyone needed to be reminded of the differences between a Band's live show setup and Nuclear Power Plant safety. That being said... you would be surprised to learn how often "cute" tactics like these are utilized by governments to leverage human behavior.
- pests 3y ago
  I think its a pretty good indicator. Like the anti-tip labels for shipping delicate things.
trehalose 3y ago
I don't really understand your metaphor. As you say, the M&Ms are just a proxy indicator. They indicate the instructions were read, but they have no direct role in the stage set. The backup diesel generators, at this nuclear power plant, could be considered a proxy indicator that attention has been paid to more fundamental pieces of the reactor, as your metaphor implies, sure. But the backup diesel generators themselves play a direct and critical role in the preventing a power outage from turning into a nuclear meltdown. Imagine if the M&Ms actually did act as a fire suppression system that would stop a pyrotechnics mishap from burning down the concert arena. That's more like the kind of M&Ms that were supposed to be in the bowl at this power plant.

christophilus 3y ago

> the justifiably-paranoid might ask what else is wrong if they've let a maintenance issue this relatively unimportant slide... Exactly. It seems like the kind of negligence that should get a license revoked and have the plant seized and handed over to a more competent manager (Duke seems reasonable). I wonder if there's precedence for such a move when it comes to utilities in the US? Edit: It doesn't seem quite as negligent after a second reading, but ... still makes me wonder what else has been done quickly and without really addressing the root issue...

roenxi 3y ago
What do you think happened here? To me it reads like there was an issue, the the issue was identified in a preemptive maintenance program and got fixed. The regulator's [0] complaint seems to be the operator may have been able to detect the problem sooner. The sounds acceptable. We're not able to run any piece of gear without the occasional failure - the argument with nuclear is a failure scenario appears to be about as damaging as the business-as-usual so all y'all be mad for putting so much effort into preventing it that nuclear became uneconomic. Uneconomic because finding and fixing a crack in a pipe in the backup system is 4-on-a-5-tier system of regulatory response and has people talking about delicensing the operator. [0] Oh wait I know this regulator. The dude who is in charge has a B. Arts in Religious Studies - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_T._Hanson https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_T._Hanson - which isn't a problem in itself but I felt it was apart of a pattern when it came to heads of the regulator. Their backgrounds didn't inspire my confidence.
- nikau 3y ago
  > We're not able to run any piece of gear without the occasional failure Seems like they could easily pressurize the pipes when idle to detect leaks
  - roenxi 3y ago
    Next time you stub your toe, reflect that you could have moved your foot differently and not stubbed it. And yet nobody called for you to be delicensed from anything, even though you were just less competent (I mean, seriously, when that day comes you'll have just fucked up walking!) and did more damage to your own body than SC nuclear plant was ever likely to do to anyone.