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Are they retiring with the same standard of living they had before? Can they sustain a medical emergency? Can they pay for their kids college? I'm sure some

Are they retiring with the same standard of living they had before? Can they sustain a medical emergency? Can they pay for their kids college? I'm sure some can do all this. But I'm pretty sure most can't.

lapcat 3y ago
> Are they retiring with the same standard of living they had before? This is a strong indicator that choice is a factor, despite your protests to the contrary. But what exactly do you mean by "standard of living"? For example, when you're employed, you have to live where the jobs are, no matter how expensive, unless you can get remote work. Whereas when you're retired you can live anywhere, perhaps a place that is both less expensive and warmer. Retired people seem less obsessed with collecting more material goods (which are often "labor saving" devices, of little relevance to those who aren't laboring) and focused more on enjoying life, traveling, spending time with family, etc. Is that a "worse" standard of living? And the children are presumably living on their own, so there's less need for bigger homes. (Who wants to spend a bunch of time, effort, and money maintaining a big house when you're older and also traveling quite a bit?) > Can they sustain a medical emergency? Have you heard of Medicare? > But I'm pretty sure most can't. Based on what? Do you have economic statistics to back up your belief?
- Draiken 3y ago
  You're telling me most retired Americans have more than hundreds of thousands of dollars in savings? I'm not gonna dive into stats for that since I'm not an American, but I would be thoroughly surprised.
  - lapcat 3y ago
    > You're telling me most retired Americans have more than hundreds of thousands of dollars in savings? How much do you think you need? I think the recommendation is something like 10x your current annual income. > I'm not gonna dive into stats for that since I'm not an American How is your nationality relevant to reading stats? If you don't want to, then just say that.
    - Draiken 3y ago
      10x? Financial independence is normally at least 20x, more like 30x. > How is your nationality relevant to reading stats? If you don't want to, then just say that. Sorry maybe I wasn't clear, but that's exactly what I meant. I won't dig into stats for the US because it's of no interest to me. That's why I mentioned I'm not from the US. I know that for my country that's absolutely not the case and I'm pretty sure it's the same for most of the world.
      - lapcat 3y ago
        > 10x? Financial independence is normally at least 20x, more like 30x. You appear to be overlooking Social Security, which is a crucial source of income that all US workers pay into their entire careers. It's not just savings. > I won't dig into stats for the US because it's of no interest to me. Yet it's interesting enough to you to make baseless empirical claims about the US. > I know that for my country that's absolutely not the case and I'm pretty sure it's the same for most of the world. That's not the way the world works.
        Draiken 3y ago
        You seemingly care about this but also can't be bothered to bring any empirical evidence for any of your claims. Goes both ways. The US is not that different from everywhere else... we all live in the same capitalist hellhole last time I checked.
        lapcat 3y ago
        > You seemingly care about this but also can't be bothered to bring any empirical evidence for any of your claims. Goes both ways. Which claims? That Social Security exists? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_(United_States) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_(United_States... That Medicare exists? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States) That 10x savings is the recommendation? https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/retirement/how-much-do-i-need-to-retire https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/retirement/how-much-do-i... > The US is not that different from everywhere else Says you, but you apparently aspire to live and work here, so it's different enough. > we all live in the same capitalist hellhole last time I checked. Have you checked North Korea?
- harimau777 3y ago
  > For example, when you're employed, you have to live where the jobs are.... Whereas when you're retired you can live... [in] a place that is both less expensive and warmer. I think that it may be just the opposite. From what I've observed, access to good public transportation is a major contributor to quality of life in old age. In the US, that requires someone to live in a much higher cost of living location.
  - lapcat 3y ago
    > From what I've observed What have you observed, and are your observations anything but anecdotal?

lapcat 3y ago

> Are they retiring with the same standard of living they had before? This is a strong indicator that choice is a factor, despite your protests to the contrary. But what exactly do you mean by "standard of living"? For example, when you're employed, you have to live where the jobs are, no matter how expensive, unless you can get remote work. Whereas when you're retired you can live anywhere, perhaps a place that is both less expensive and warmer. Retired people seem less obsessed with collecting more material goods (which are often "labor saving" devices, of little relevance to those who aren't laboring) and focused more on enjoying life, traveling, spending time with family, etc. Is that a "worse" standard of living? And the children are presumably living on their own, so there's less need for bigger homes. (Who wants to spend a bunch of time, effort, and money maintaining a big house when you're older and also traveling quite a bit?) > Can they sustain a medical emergency? Have you heard of Medicare? > But I'm pretty sure most can't. Based on what? Do you have economic statistics to back up your belief?

Draiken 3y ago
You're telling me most retired Americans have more than hundreds of thousands of dollars in savings? I'm not gonna dive into stats for that since I'm not an American, but I would be thoroughly surprised.
- lapcat 3y ago
  > You're telling me most retired Americans have more than hundreds of thousands of dollars in savings? How much do you think you need? I think the recommendation is something like 10x your current annual income. > I'm not gonna dive into stats for that since I'm not an American How is your nationality relevant to reading stats? If you don't want to, then just say that.
  - Draiken 3y ago
    10x? Financial independence is normally at least 20x, more like 30x. > How is your nationality relevant to reading stats? If you don't want to, then just say that. Sorry maybe I wasn't clear, but that's exactly what I meant. I won't dig into stats for the US because it's of no interest to me. That's why I mentioned I'm not from the US. I know that for my country that's absolutely not the case and I'm pretty sure it's the same for most of the world.
    - lapcat 3y ago
      > 10x? Financial independence is normally at least 20x, more like 30x. You appear to be overlooking Social Security, which is a crucial source of income that all US workers pay into their entire careers. It's not just savings. > I won't dig into stats for the US because it's of no interest to me. Yet it's interesting enough to you to make baseless empirical claims about the US. > I know that for my country that's absolutely not the case and I'm pretty sure it's the same for most of the world. That's not the way the world works.
      - Draiken 3y ago
        You seemingly care about this but also can't be bothered to bring any empirical evidence for any of your claims. Goes both ways. The US is not that different from everywhere else... we all live in the same capitalist hellhole last time I checked.
        lapcat 3y ago
        > You seemingly care about this but also can't be bothered to bring any empirical evidence for any of your claims. Goes both ways. Which claims? That Social Security exists? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_(United_States) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_(United_States... That Medicare exists? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States) That 10x savings is the recommendation? https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/retirement/how-much-do-i-need-to-retire https://www.fidelity.com/viewpoints/retirement/how-much-do-i... > The US is not that different from everywhere else Says you, but you apparently aspire to live and work here, so it's different enough. > we all live in the same capitalist hellhole last time I checked. Have you checked North Korea?
harimau777 3y ago
> For example, when you're employed, you have to live where the jobs are.... Whereas when you're retired you can live... [in] a place that is both less expensive and warmer. I think that it may be just the opposite. From what I've observed, access to good public transportation is a major contributor to quality of life in old age. In the US, that requires someone to live in a much higher cost of living location.
- lapcat 3y ago
  > From what I've observed What have you observed, and are your observations anything but anecdotal?