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$4 per what? Do you even know? Have you heard of the lightning network that is a fast transaction layer built on top of Bitcoin?

• lawn 3y ago
  Is it too hard to comprehend what I wrote? Average fee per transaction? I have heard about this mystery thing that supposedly solves all of Bitcoins problems. Except that it's been years and it's still not ready, you still have load it up via the expensive transactions and you have to use third party services to get a somewhat useable UX. Lightning is even more of a joke than Bitcoin is.
  • krupan 3y ago
    Yeah, you don't even have the right units on that metric, Bitcoin fees are not per transaction. They are not scaled by the amount of Bitcoin you are transacting either. It's a per byte fee. Different transactions take up more or less space on the blockchain depending on how many addresses are involved. Here's a good explanation: https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin/fees/ https://99bitcoins.com/bitcoin/fees/
    • lawn 3y ago
      Yes? And you can still get an average fee per transaction to get a rough idea of how expensive it is.
      • krupan 3y ago
        I suppose, but it's just not a very useful number. If you are sending a billion dollars of Bitcoin from one address to another, the transaction fee could be one dollar. No bank in this universe will do that amount for that cheap (and the settlement time would be way more than Bitcoin's 10 minutes). The overall point I'm trying to make is it's hard to compare Bitcoin to our current banking system if you don't really even understand how Bitcoin works
        • lawn 3y ago
          Why do you assume I don't know how Bitcoin works? Because I'm not using sat/byte, which would only confuse the casual reader? My point was that for regular payments that regular people do Bitcoin is simply too expensive for. The average transaction amount is indeed very useful to backup that statement.
          • krupan 3y ago
            I assume you don't know how bitcoin works because you are using the same arguments against it that most ignorant people use. The fact that you do know about it and you are still boiling things down to those explanations/arguments is even more discouraging to me. This is hacker news, we don't need to boil things down for the casual reader here, this audience wants to understand the detailed nuances and their implications. Yes, transaction fees are too high for everyday small purchases. The 10 minute transaction/confirmation time is too slow for that too. That's why (just like in our current banking system) layers are being built on top of bitcoin to solve those problems (the lightning network, for example). The trade off is that these fast and cheap transaction layers will have a little less security and longer final settlement times (similar to our current system but actually still way more secure, and also permissionless, free of central control, etc., etc.).
            • lawn 3y ago
              So my argument, that Bitcoin is too expensive which you even agree with, is wrong because "ignorant people" use it? It's amazing the amount of mental gymnastics Bitcoin maximalists come up with.
              • krupan 3y ago
                Let me try and say it more simply: Your argument is kinda like saying, "this 1 ton pickup uses too much gas." My argument is kinda like saying, "this 1 ton pickup uses too much gas, if all you are doing is driving yourself around town. But if you really need to haul some cargo, it's a great vehicle." Is that mental gymnastics? If so then I guess I'm guilty.