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This is an absolutely correct question to ask. It's also a good question to ask people who claim they can visualize things well, but can't draw. I think people

This is an absolutely correct question to ask. It's also a good question to ask people who claim they can visualize things well, but can't draw. I think people vastly, vastly overstate how well they can actually visualize something in their mind. Most people can't visualize a circle of a solid color and change the color in their mind, let alone visualize a face or anything significant.

htss2013 3y ago
Humans seem optimized for detailed recognition of visuals, not reproduction of them. Makes evolutionary sense because you can easily see the utility of detailed recognition, but what justifies the additional burden of detailed reproduction? People who can draw detailed reproductions are either oddballs with photographic memory, or they've perfected the skill of adjusting their drawings as they develop gradient descent style using detailed recognition as the judge of where to stop.
circuit10 3y ago
I can definitely visualise those things in a way that sort of feels like seeing it but when I do that my brain really works with abstract concepts where if you focus on something in particular you make up the finer detail on the fly
- Nevermark 3y ago
  Yes, I can visualize almost anything, but there is a huge fovea aspect where my focus has to zoom around to check/see all the details. But if the details are unconstrained conceptually, or not tied to a remembered object, then details won’t be consistent as I move around. The memory palace thing works for me too, if I am not constantly moving things around.
  - throw1234651234 3y ago
    Memory palace works just fine without CLEAR visualization. CLEAR visualization is when you can do what was claimed of Tesla - move around complex systems and actually see them to scale / detail. There is no way in hell most people can take a transmission and put it together in their head and re-arrange it. Working memory doesn't allow for that, unless it's some entirely different system of processing in the brain.
InSteady 3y ago
I can draw sort of ok, but only because I've practiced a bit. I can visualize quite well, I assume because of some innate ability + I practiced extensively as a child for fun. It is definitely a skill that requires focused training, at least in my experience, so it makes some sense that the average person wouldn't spend too much time going out of their way to practice. If I get out of the habit for whatever reason, I'll slowly lose proficiency at quickly and easily picturing objects in near life-like detail, manipulating them skillfully, rendering complex scenes, holding images with eyes open or under distraction / activity, etc. Objects will start off grainy/foggy by default and only clarify if I really can focus. Scenes and large complex objects will be much harder to hold together as a whole with distinct parts/areas. Changing an object results in more fog or losing the image temporarily. That kind of thing.

htss2013 3y ago

Humans seem optimized for detailed recognition of visuals, not reproduction of them. Makes evolutionary sense because you can easily see the utility of detailed recognition, but what justifies the additional burden of detailed reproduction? People who can draw detailed reproductions are either oddballs with photographic memory, or they've perfected the skill of adjusting their drawings as they develop gradient descent style using detailed recognition as the judge of where to stop.

circuit10 3y ago

I can definitely visualise those things in a way that sort of feels like seeing it but when I do that my brain really works with abstract concepts where if you focus on something in particular you make up the finer detail on the fly

Nevermark 3y ago
Yes, I can visualize almost anything, but there is a huge fovea aspect where my focus has to zoom around to check/see all the details. But if the details are unconstrained conceptually, or not tied to a remembered object, then details won’t be consistent as I move around. The memory palace thing works for me too, if I am not constantly moving things around.
- throw1234651234 3y ago
  Memory palace works just fine without CLEAR visualization. CLEAR visualization is when you can do what was claimed of Tesla - move around complex systems and actually see them to scale / detail. There is no way in hell most people can take a transmission and put it together in their head and re-arrange it. Working memory doesn't allow for that, unless it's some entirely different system of processing in the brain.

InSteady 3y ago

I can draw sort of ok, but only because I've practiced a bit. I can visualize quite well, I assume because of some innate ability + I practiced extensively as a child for fun. It is definitely a skill that requires focused training, at least in my experience, so it makes some sense that the average person wouldn't spend too much time going out of their way to practice. If I get out of the habit for whatever reason, I'll slowly lose proficiency at quickly and easily picturing objects in near life-like detail, manipulating them skillfully, rendering complex scenes, holding images with eyes open or under distraction / activity, etc. Objects will start off grainy/foggy by default and only clarify if I really can focus. Scenes and large complex objects will be much harder to hold together as a whole with distinct parts/areas. Changing an object results in more fog or losing the image temporarily. That kind of thing.