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You’re not legally obligated to tip so I’m not sure how it would be abolished. Best just to stop doing it if you don’t want to. I’m not sure a law explicitly s

You’re not legally obligated to tip so I’m not sure how it would be abolished. Best just to stop doing it if you don’t want to. I’m not sure a law explicitly stopping people from giving more money would pass, but maybe one explicitly asking restaurants to stop asking for tips would work.

droopyEyelids 3y ago
The way I've been putting this into practice is to ask my server for their venmo/cashapp and tipping them through that, then writing on the receipt "I don't believe in tipping" This is the only way I've found to attack the structural problem of tipping without hurting the workers. This is still tricky for the worker, because waitstaff management uses tip totals as a proxy for worker productivity. I try to offset that by writing on the receipt, which the worker can share to demonstrate it wasn't because they did a bad job. The rest of the incentives are impacted in the way I want them to be, except for taxation, which I believe in, and the kitchen staff who are usually underpaid with the expectation that a percent of tips will flow to them.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > which the worker can share to demonstrate it wasn't because they did a bad job Friends in hospitality. Unfortunately, there is a contingent of assholes who do this in lieu of tipping at all. This doubly fucks the server in a place with pooled tips; their colleagues now question whether they stole the tip.
  - voisin 3y ago
    If the tip is for good service, which is ostensibly what it is for, then why should it be pooled in the first place? If it is out of fairness to the back of kitchen staff, then they should take a front of house job instead. That’s like an engineer demanding to get part of a sales guy’s commission on a sale.
- fishtoaster 3y ago
  > This is the only way I've found to attack the structural problem of tipping without hurting the workers. That's my big problem. I hate tipping, but I still tip well - to do otherwise is to punish the people with the least ability to change the system. The only good way I know of to attack the structural problem is to preferentially frequent the few restaurants with a non-tip policy.
Wowfunhappy 3y ago
But if the workers rely on tips in order to e.g. pay rent, I don't want to be the a-hole that doesn't do it. I want restaurants to just charge what it costs to make and serve food and I can choose to eat there or not based on the listed price.
- endisneigh 3y ago
  My take is that this is just brainwashing. Technically other than farming and a couple other things (not restaurants), the business owner must pay them the minimum wage if tips don’t meet it, so I personally don’t see any issue. That being said I generally get take out because many restaurants in my area have a kitchen appreciation fee when you dine in.
  - kevingadd 3y ago
    Wage theft is really common though, so if they don't get tips their pay may end up just being low. Not that it's your fault, but that's the reality.
- colpabar 3y ago
  I was at a restaurant the other day and on the bottom of the menu it said "a 2.5% tip will be added to all transactions to help us pay our staff" and all I could think was why can't they just add a dollar to some/all of the menu items instead? If a restaurant needs more money to pay its employees, they should just charge more money. I really don't get it.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    I refuse to return to businesses that do this. Restaurants, stop being sleazy and manipulative. Just be honest and raise your prices.
    - voisin 3y ago
      They fear being honest because not everyone will do it. So the right answer is regulation to ensure everyone does the same thing transparently.
lkbm 3y ago
> You’re not legally obligated to tip so I’m not sure how it would be abolished. You legally require it be removed from receipts and PoS systems, and mandate that all tips be taken by the venue rather than going to the workers (or at minimum be distributed evenly between all workers). A decade or so ago, there was some talk of it eventually being banned by he Supreme Court due to it being de-facto racial discrimination in pay. Sure, you can always slip them something under the table, but right now it's mostly an official, sanctioned part of their pay.

droopyEyelids 3y ago

The way I've been putting this into practice is to ask my server for their venmo/cashapp and tipping them through that, then writing on the receipt "I don't believe in tipping" This is the only way I've found to attack the structural problem of tipping without hurting the workers. This is still tricky for the worker, because waitstaff management uses tip totals as a proxy for worker productivity. I try to offset that by writing on the receipt, which the worker can share to demonstrate it wasn't because they did a bad job. The rest of the incentives are impacted in the way I want them to be, except for taxation, which I believe in, and the kitchen staff who are usually underpaid with the expectation that a percent of tips will flow to them.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> which the worker can share to demonstrate it wasn't because they did a bad job Friends in hospitality. Unfortunately, there is a contingent of assholes who do this in lieu of tipping at all. This doubly fucks the server in a place with pooled tips; their colleagues now question whether they stole the tip.
- voisin 3y ago
  If the tip is for good service, which is ostensibly what it is for, then why should it be pooled in the first place? If it is out of fairness to the back of kitchen staff, then they should take a front of house job instead. That’s like an engineer demanding to get part of a sales guy’s commission on a sale.
fishtoaster 3y ago
> This is the only way I've found to attack the structural problem of tipping without hurting the workers. That's my big problem. I hate tipping, but I still tip well - to do otherwise is to punish the people with the least ability to change the system. The only good way I know of to attack the structural problem is to preferentially frequent the few restaurants with a non-tip policy.

Wowfunhappy 3y ago

But if the workers rely on tips in order to e.g. pay rent, I don't want to be the a-hole that doesn't do it. I want restaurants to just charge what it costs to make and serve food and I can choose to eat there or not based on the listed price.

endisneigh 3y ago
My take is that this is just brainwashing. Technically other than farming and a couple other things (not restaurants), the business owner must pay them the minimum wage if tips don’t meet it, so I personally don’t see any issue. That being said I generally get take out because many restaurants in my area have a kitchen appreciation fee when you dine in.
- kevingadd 3y ago
  Wage theft is really common though, so if they don't get tips their pay may end up just being low. Not that it's your fault, but that's the reality.
colpabar 3y ago
I was at a restaurant the other day and on the bottom of the menu it said "a 2.5% tip will be added to all transactions to help us pay our staff" and all I could think was why can't they just add a dollar to some/all of the menu items instead? If a restaurant needs more money to pay its employees, they should just charge more money. I really don't get it.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  I refuse to return to businesses that do this. Restaurants, stop being sleazy and manipulative. Just be honest and raise your prices.
  - voisin 3y ago
    They fear being honest because not everyone will do it. So the right answer is regulation to ensure everyone does the same thing transparently.

lkbm 3y ago

> You’re not legally obligated to tip so I’m not sure how it would be abolished. You legally require it be removed from receipts and PoS systems, and mandate that all tips be taken by the venue rather than going to the workers (or at minimum be distributed evenly between all workers). A decade or so ago, there was some talk of it eventually being banned by he Supreme Court due to it being de-facto racial discrimination in pay. Sure, you can always slip them something under the table, but right now it's mostly an official, sanctioned part of their pay.