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I find all this really incredible as well. But at the same time I also find it really 'mindblowing' that I am able to think about why and how all of this stuff

by mikub 3y ago

I find all this really incredible as well. But at the same time I also find it really 'mindblowing' that I am able to think about why and how all of this stuff was made, and while thinking about it, there will always come a point where you have to at least 'think' about an creator. Not that I think it was made especially for us, but it's still very strange. Somewhere I read when you think about the universe it is like "The Universe thinking about itself.".

tomohelix 3y ago
I agree. I actually think that is a very common thought, at least from what I have seen with my colleagues who are mostly scientists in engineering and biotech. It could be because of our background but the kind of complexity and seemingly genius engineering solutions in some biological systems just boggle the mind and make us question how it happened. We often handwave them with evolution and sure we can come up with some ideas of how it actually evolved but at some point I personally felt some explanations we got became too contrived and overly convenient and nearly unfalsifiable... To be honest though, I still don't think a creator is absolutely necessary. But I also think there is nothing wrong with the idea that there is one. I just personally don't think this creator, if exist, would belong to any of the major religion out there.
- FluffyClouds 3y ago
  We are a tad beyond handwaving, but with all the information overload it's hard to recognize scientific breakthroughs anymore. Anyway thermodynamics did it. https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.3271 https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.3271 Most people won't like this answer, because it's too impersonal. Thus the search for a more inspiring origin story continues. There is no drama in thermodynamics, no love, no revenge, although there are explosions.
  - tomohelix 3y ago
    That is a great paper! Yes, from my engineering school I know if we dig deep enough, it would all be thermodynamics. But I was not sure if anyone dig that deep yet. This paper seems to be deeper than what I thought was done. Strange how I didn't see it, seems very relevant especially with all the LLM rage these days.
Cyphase 3y ago
> Somewhere I read when you think about the universe it is like "The Universe thinking about itself.". This reminds me of this quote from Jill Tarter of SETI, particularly the last sentence: “Might it be the discovery of a distant civilization and our common cosmic origins that finally drives home the message of the bond among all humans? Whether we’re born in San Francisco or Sudan or close to the heart of the Milky Way Galaxy, we are the products of a billion-year lineage of wandering stardust. We, all of us, are what happens when a primordial mixture of hydrogen and helium evolves for so long that it begins to ask where it came from.” source: https://www.ted.com/talks/jill_tarter_join_the_seti_search https://www.ted.com/talks/jill_tarter_join_the_seti_search (@ 3:02) (I copied this nearly verbatim from another comment of mine: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37061363 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37061363)
Jedd 3y ago
I suspect it's been used in many places - we need to summon that quote investigator! - but I did make a note of this when I read Surface Detail by Iain M. Banks: "All you ever were was a little piece of the universe, thinking to itself."

by mikub 3y ago

tomohelix 3y ago

I agree. I actually think that is a very common thought, at least from what I have seen with my colleagues who are mostly scientists in engineering and biotech. It could be because of our background but the kind of complexity and seemingly genius engineering solutions in some biological systems just boggle the mind and make us question how it happened. We often handwave them with evolution and sure we can come up with some ideas of how it actually evolved but at some point I personally felt some explanations we got became too contrived and overly convenient and nearly unfalsifiable... To be honest though, I still don't think a creator is absolutely necessary. But I also think there is nothing wrong with the idea that there is one. I just personally don't think this creator, if exist, would belong to any of the major religion out there.

FluffyClouds 3y ago
We are a tad beyond handwaving, but with all the information overload it's hard to recognize scientific breakthroughs anymore. Anyway thermodynamics did it. https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.3271 https://arxiv.org/abs/1203.3271 Most people won't like this answer, because it's too impersonal. Thus the search for a more inspiring origin story continues. There is no drama in thermodynamics, no love, no revenge, although there are explosions.
- tomohelix 3y ago
  That is a great paper! Yes, from my engineering school I know if we dig deep enough, it would all be thermodynamics. But I was not sure if anyone dig that deep yet. This paper seems to be deeper than what I thought was done. Strange how I didn't see it, seems very relevant especially with all the LLM rage these days.

Cyphase 3y ago

> Somewhere I read when you think about the universe it is like "The Universe thinking about itself.". This reminds me of this quote from Jill Tarter of SETI, particularly the last sentence: “Might it be the discovery of a distant civilization and our common cosmic origins that finally drives home the message of the bond among all humans? Whether we’re born in San Francisco or Sudan or close to the heart of the Milky Way Galaxy, we are the products of a billion-year lineage of wandering stardust. We, all of us, are what happens when a primordial mixture of hydrogen and helium evolves for so long that it begins to ask where it came from.” source: https://www.ted.com/talks/jill_tarter_join_the_seti_search https://www.ted.com/talks/jill_tarter_join_the_seti_search (@ 3:02) (I copied this nearly verbatim from another comment of mine: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37061363 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37061363)

Jedd 3y ago

I suspect it's been used in many places - we need to summon that quote investigator! - but I did make a note of this when I read Surface Detail by Iain M. Banks: "All you ever were was a little piece of the universe, thinking to itself."