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In what situation, when it comes to deployed products is any of this relevant? Having used Python for decades, across multiple organizations starting from mega

In what situation, when it comes to deployed products is any of this relevant? Having used Python for decades, across multiple organizations starting from mega-corps and down to five programmers I've never used built Python binaries for any project that required Python. It's not hard to build your own, and it gives you better control of what's included (Python has a handful of optional compile-time dependencies, which most projects don't need). ---- Also, on personal level, I don't think I ever use built binaries from Python.org. I either build them myself, or use whatever the distro maintainers built. Maybe if you develop on Mac / Windows then it matters... but you already chose to suffer by not having control of your tools -- another drop in a bucket, does it even matter? NB. Also, official Docker images of Python don't use binaries from Python.org. So, nobody who deploys in containers is likely to either build themselves, or to use something other than Python.org binaries.

evrimoztamur 3y ago
I think it is. There are still millions of devices which either use their own distribution's provided Python package or some form of prepackaged container.
- crabbone 3y ago
  Why would what was described in the article be of any use to these devices you describe? If it's built by distribution -- the article is irrelevant. If they use prepackaged container -- the article is irrelevant :|
tmpX7dMeXU 3y ago
As someone that’s done both, you are certainly overstating the suffering endured by not compiling your own Python. I very much believe that this is a consequence of your ideology rather than any indication of frequency.
- crabbone 3y ago
  Suffering doesn't come from not compiling. Suffering comes from inability to trust your system. Not everyone suffers from this. Most don't care. But then the question is why would they care in the case described by the article, if they don't give a rats ass in general?
jsjohnst 3y ago
> but you already chose to suffer by not having control of your tools ~Gaslight much?~ Edit: How about not insulting people who don’t share your point of view?
- Aachen 3y ago
  > In contemporary language, gaslighting is a colloquialism describing the subjective experience of having one's reality repeatedly questioned I understand it's even more contemporary to start using the word for anything where you could otherwise respond "don't be a dick", but I'm not sure what alternative word we could still use to mean gaslighting if gaslighting gets hijacked for a general negative meaning
  - jsjohnst 3y ago
    Fair point! I was basing it more on this definition: > to grossly mislead or deceive (someone) especially for one's own advantage But even that doesn’t fit ideally, so I edited the post.
- crabbone 3y ago
  That's not a point of view. This is a consequence of a choice. If you use an operating system that denies you the right to verify its source, then why do you care if an individual component allows you to do that? -- This doesn't make sense. Your system is compromised because you agreed to use a compromised system. This doesn't say that whoever does this is an idiot. It's about making choices that make sense. If you sign up for a boxing club, but then start complaining about being hit in the face, then you aren't consistent. If you use Windows, and then complain that some component doesn't have a good verification process, then you are just as consistent as the guy who complains about being hit on the face in a boxing club.
  - jsjohnst 3y ago
    Thanks for confirming your true colors. Have a nice life!
nextlevelwizard 3y ago
I have worked with Python for well over a decade and only time I have built my own is to test out the up coming version before it is readily available for my distro. On Windows I just download from python.org and on Mac I get whatever homebrew gets me. Never have I even thought about need to optimise my python executable.
- crabbone 3y ago
  > whatever homebrew gets me Then you aren't using what's described in the article. > On Windows I've already commented on this. This is not a serious deployment. It doesn't matter if it's done with more supervision or less. It's for "recreational" use.

evrimoztamur 3y ago

I think it is. There are still millions of devices which either use their own distribution's provided Python package or some form of prepackaged container.

crabbone 3y ago
Why would what was described in the article be of any use to these devices you describe? If it's built by distribution -- the article is irrelevant. If they use prepackaged container -- the article is irrelevant :|

tmpX7dMeXU 3y ago

As someone that’s done both, you are certainly overstating the suffering endured by not compiling your own Python. I very much believe that this is a consequence of your ideology rather than any indication of frequency.

crabbone 3y ago
Suffering doesn't come from not compiling. Suffering comes from inability to trust your system. Not everyone suffers from this. Most don't care. But then the question is why would they care in the case described by the article, if they don't give a rats ass in general?

jsjohnst 3y ago

> but you already chose to suffer by not having control of your tools ~Gaslight much?~ Edit: How about not insulting people who don’t share your point of view?

Aachen 3y ago
> In contemporary language, gaslighting is a colloquialism describing the subjective experience of having one's reality repeatedly questioned I understand it's even more contemporary to start using the word for anything where you could otherwise respond "don't be a dick", but I'm not sure what alternative word we could still use to mean gaslighting if gaslighting gets hijacked for a general negative meaning
- jsjohnst 3y ago
  Fair point! I was basing it more on this definition: > to grossly mislead or deceive (someone) especially for one's own advantage But even that doesn’t fit ideally, so I edited the post.
crabbone 3y ago
That's not a point of view. This is a consequence of a choice. If you use an operating system that denies you the right to verify its source, then why do you care if an individual component allows you to do that? -- This doesn't make sense. Your system is compromised because you agreed to use a compromised system. This doesn't say that whoever does this is an idiot. It's about making choices that make sense. If you sign up for a boxing club, but then start complaining about being hit in the face, then you aren't consistent. If you use Windows, and then complain that some component doesn't have a good verification process, then you are just as consistent as the guy who complains about being hit on the face in a boxing club.
- jsjohnst 3y ago
  Thanks for confirming your true colors. Have a nice life!

nextlevelwizard 3y ago

I have worked with Python for well over a decade and only time I have built my own is to test out the up coming version before it is readily available for my distro. On Windows I just download from python.org and on Mac I get whatever homebrew gets me. Never have I even thought about need to optimise my python executable.

crabbone 3y ago
> whatever homebrew gets me Then you aren't using what's described in the article. > On Windows I've already commented on this. This is not a serious deployment. It doesn't matter if it's done with more supervision or less. It's for "recreational" use.