6 ms·

> Yet if a weakness is common, it also means that human coders frequently make the same mistake as well. It only means programmers commonly talk about it. This

> Yet if a weakness is common, it also means that human coders frequently make the same mistake as well. It only means programmers commonly talk about it. This isn't the same thing as measuring incidence in production or distribution. Anyway, i'd argue the real question is "can the chatbot fix the code if requested to".

lolinder 3y ago
> It only means programmers commonly talk about it. This isn't the same thing as measuring incidence in production or distribution. Copilot was primarily trained on GitHub projects, not on communication between programmers. Patterns that frequently show up in Copilot output are most likely prevalent on GitHub, which is a pretty good indicator that they're common in production code.
- prosim 3y ago
  That’s no longer true. Copilot uses the same ChatGPT-3.5 model as, well, ChatGPT. If it were trained on just GitHub projects, the chat features wouldn’t work at all.
  - lolinder 3y ago
    You're assuming that Copilot Chat and the regular completion are the same model. Do you have a source that says so? I'd assumed that they were two different models, since they're quite different tasks.
    - prosim 3y ago
      Footnote 1 on page 2 explicitly mentions the 3.5 model and the research in this paper is only about auto completion: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2306.15033.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/2306.15033.pdf And this blog post states “beyond Codex”, again for auto completion: https://github.blog/2023-07-28-smarter-more-efficient-coding-github-copilot-goes-beyond-codex-with-improved-ai-model/ https://github.blog/2023-07-28-smarter-more-efficient-coding... Lastly, OpenAI states on the original Codex page: “OpenAI Codex is a descendant of GPT-3; its training data contains both natural language and billions of lines of source code from publicly available sources, including code in public GitHub repositories.” - It included GitHub repos, but it never was only GitHub repos. https://openai.com/blog/openai-codex https://openai.com/blog/openai-codex Update: GitHub Community Manager confirms it here: https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/56975#discussioncomment-6086471 https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/56975#discussi...
      - lolinder 3y ago
        As I said to the other commenter, I specifically avoided saying "only", I said "primarily", and I should have clarified that I meant "primarily fine-tuned". My point is simply that it is far more likely to spit out results that are patterned after GitHub than results that are patterned after any inter-programmer communications. Also, I wasn't contesting that autocomplete uses GPT 3.5 as the base model, I was contesting the idea that it uses the same derivative model as chat.
    - empath-nirvana 3y ago
      you don't need to use the chat to test whether it was exclusively trained on github or not. I started typing this in my IDE in a rust project I already had open: // the following function prints out the best soccer players of all time, which teams they played for, and why they were great as a hashmap fn soccer_greats() -> Hashmap<String,(Vec<String>, String)> { let mut hm = HashMap::new(); it completed with the following: hm.insert("Pele", (vec!["Santos", "New York Cosmos"], "He scored over 1000 goals in his career".to_string())); hm.insert("Maradona", (vec!["Boca Juniors", "Barcelona", "Napoli"], "He won the world cup with Argentina".to_string())); hm.insert("Messi", (vec!["Barcelona"], "He has won the Ballon d'Or 6 times".to_string())); hm.insert("Ronaldo", (vec!["Barcelona", "Inter Milan", "Real Madrid", "AC Milan", "Corinthians"], "He won the world cup with Brazil".to_string())); hm.insert("Zidane", (vec!["Juventus", "Real Madrid"], "He won the world cup with France".to_string())); } I don't believe that information is going to be on github anywhere, but i could be mistaken.
      - arp242 3y ago
        You need to indent code with two spaces for it to render as-is.
      - lolinder 3y ago
        You're addressing a straw man, I never claimed it was "exclusively" trained on GitHub. I said "primarily", though I should have been specific and said "primarily fine-tuned". In the context of the person I replied to, the point is that it isn't made up primarily of a bunch of communications between programmers.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

lolinder 3y ago

> It only means programmers commonly talk about it. This isn't the same thing as measuring incidence in production or distribution. Copilot was primarily trained on GitHub projects, not on communication between programmers. Patterns that frequently show up in Copilot output are most likely prevalent on GitHub, which is a pretty good indicator that they're common in production code.

prosim 3y ago
That’s no longer true. Copilot uses the same ChatGPT-3.5 model as, well, ChatGPT. If it were trained on just GitHub projects, the chat features wouldn’t work at all.
- lolinder 3y ago
  You're assuming that Copilot Chat and the regular completion are the same model. Do you have a source that says so? I'd assumed that they were two different models, since they're quite different tasks.
  - prosim 3y ago
    Footnote 1 on page 2 explicitly mentions the 3.5 model and the research in this paper is only about auto completion: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2306.15033.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/2306.15033.pdf And this blog post states “beyond Codex”, again for auto completion: https://github.blog/2023-07-28-smarter-more-efficient-coding-github-copilot-goes-beyond-codex-with-improved-ai-model/ https://github.blog/2023-07-28-smarter-more-efficient-coding... Lastly, OpenAI states on the original Codex page: “OpenAI Codex is a descendant of GPT-3; its training data contains both natural language and billions of lines of source code from publicly available sources, including code in public GitHub repositories.” - It included GitHub repos, but it never was only GitHub repos. https://openai.com/blog/openai-codex https://openai.com/blog/openai-codex Update: GitHub Community Manager confirms it here: https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/56975#discussioncomment-6086471 https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/56975#discussi...
    - lolinder 3y ago
      As I said to the other commenter, I specifically avoided saying "only", I said "primarily", and I should have clarified that I meant "primarily fine-tuned". My point is simply that it is far more likely to spit out results that are patterned after GitHub than results that are patterned after any inter-programmer communications. Also, I wasn't contesting that autocomplete uses GPT 3.5 as the base model, I was contesting the idea that it uses the same derivative model as chat.
  - empath-nirvana 3y ago
    you don't need to use the chat to test whether it was exclusively trained on github or not. I started typing this in my IDE in a rust project I already had open: // the following function prints out the best soccer players of all time, which teams they played for, and why they were great as a hashmap fn soccer_greats() -> Hashmap<String,(Vec<String>, String)> { let mut hm = HashMap::new(); it completed with the following: hm.insert("Pele", (vec!["Santos", "New York Cosmos"], "He scored over 1000 goals in his career".to_string())); hm.insert("Maradona", (vec!["Boca Juniors", "Barcelona", "Napoli"], "He won the world cup with Argentina".to_string())); hm.insert("Messi", (vec!["Barcelona"], "He has won the Ballon d'Or 6 times".to_string())); hm.insert("Ronaldo", (vec!["Barcelona", "Inter Milan", "Real Madrid", "AC Milan", "Corinthians"], "He won the world cup with Brazil".to_string())); hm.insert("Zidane", (vec!["Juventus", "Real Madrid"], "He won the world cup with France".to_string())); } I don't believe that information is going to be on github anywhere, but i could be mistaken.
    - arp242 3y ago
      You need to indent code with two spaces for it to render as-is.
    - lolinder 3y ago
      You're addressing a straw man, I never claimed it was "exclusively" trained on GitHub. I said "primarily", though I should have been specific and said "primarily fine-tuned". In the context of the person I replied to, the point is that it isn't made up primarily of a bunch of communications between programmers.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]