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The vehicle starting to randomly roll backwards is quite bad as it might take a while to notice for the driver. Having a roll back protection that can fail like

The vehicle starting to randomly roll backwards is quite bad as it might take a while to notice for the driver. Having a roll back protection that can fail like that is probably worse than none at all. It is quite often pedestrians walk between cars in stand still traffic. The driver might also leave the car while on hill hold, which might end badly if the parking brake can't be engaged by the computer. In my experience, features like these need to be very well thought out and seamless, otherwise they confuse and you got no idea what and why stuff happens. I mean, just having a clutch pedal makes the driver intention way more explicit. I don't think the "press the gas thinking it is the brake flipping the car on a wedge in a garage" accidents happen with manual cars at all, since a panicking driver would depress the accelerator and clutch.

giantg2 3y ago
"The vehicle starting to randomly roll backwards is quite bad as it might take a while to notice for the driver." Sure, drivers might be stupid. "The driver might also leave the car while on hill hold," Sure, some drivers might be extremely stupid. I think it would be hard for the computer to figure out if the action was intended or not. Just look at ll the BS with automatic braking when trying to hook up a trailer to tow. There has to be a cutoff somewhere. If it's really a problem, then we need better driver testing is someone is really that dumb. "if the parking brake can't be engaged by the computer." Do any of them actually do this? All the ones I've seen use the regular brakes. Yes, the hill assist was started to help people in a manual on a hill and I agree that there is more intention when using a third pedal. That's the tradeoff - a system that make the physical act easier while removing intention. Yeah, not having the system might be better in some ways. This shouldn't be that dangerous because we're dealing with stopped vehicles and slow speeds. The tradeoff is stopping many newbies from rolling back into the car behind them, vs hopefully tiny number of people who are so stupid as to exit the vehicle in the 1-2 seconds that the brake is still applied. Better to get rid of that last group with stricter testing.
- rightbyte 3y ago
  Ye well I agree in general. It is hard to figure out intention and many cars seem to be on a slippery slope of adding features to protect the user from other features. Except the surprise rollback. I think it is really hard to notice if you don't expect it, if it starts off slowly. A Scania truck will engage the parking brake on hill hold if you disengage the seat belt or turn the engine off. The manual variant just allows hill hold for like 5 seconds and then releases the brakes after some warning sounds. I haven't really tried out how any car with hill hold and electric pbrake behaves when you do strange things, so dunno if any engage the p-brake or locks the transmission.
  - giantg2 3y ago
    Interesting. That truck is the first one I've heard of that can do that.
- joshuanapoli 3y ago
  Tesla automatically engages the parking break if the driver exits the vehicle while stopped.

giantg2 3y ago

"The vehicle starting to randomly roll backwards is quite bad as it might take a while to notice for the driver." Sure, drivers might be stupid. "The driver might also leave the car while on hill hold," Sure, some drivers might be extremely stupid. I think it would be hard for the computer to figure out if the action was intended or not. Just look at ll the BS with automatic braking when trying to hook up a trailer to tow. There has to be a cutoff somewhere. If it's really a problem, then we need better driver testing is someone is really that dumb. "if the parking brake can't be engaged by the computer." Do any of them actually do this? All the ones I've seen use the regular brakes. Yes, the hill assist was started to help people in a manual on a hill and I agree that there is more intention when using a third pedal. That's the tradeoff - a system that make the physical act easier while removing intention. Yeah, not having the system might be better in some ways. This shouldn't be that dangerous because we're dealing with stopped vehicles and slow speeds. The tradeoff is stopping many newbies from rolling back into the car behind them, vs hopefully tiny number of people who are so stupid as to exit the vehicle in the 1-2 seconds that the brake is still applied. Better to get rid of that last group with stricter testing.

rightbyte 3y ago
Ye well I agree in general. It is hard to figure out intention and many cars seem to be on a slippery slope of adding features to protect the user from other features. Except the surprise rollback. I think it is really hard to notice if you don't expect it, if it starts off slowly. A Scania truck will engage the parking brake on hill hold if you disengage the seat belt or turn the engine off. The manual variant just allows hill hold for like 5 seconds and then releases the brakes after some warning sounds. I haven't really tried out how any car with hill hold and electric pbrake behaves when you do strange things, so dunno if any engage the p-brake or locks the transmission.
- giantg2 3y ago
  Interesting. That truck is the first one I've heard of that can do that.
joshuanapoli 3y ago
Tesla automatically engages the parking break if the driver exits the vehicle while stopped.