3 ms·

I have to ask, what's the goal of an engine focused on web deploys? There isn't any indication that the browser is ever going to be a competitor to standalone

I have to ask, what's the goal of an engine focused on web deploys? There isn't any indication that the browser is ever going to be a competitor to standalone builds, and as a game developer I would never consider using an engine that immediately sacrifices the livelihood of my studio by precluding every platform I can make money on.

FredrikNoren 3y ago
So we view the browser as one distribution channel among many. We want Ambient to run everywhere. The first platforms we built out Ambient for were actually desktop native, we've since then also added the web support. That said, we do believe that the web _is_ changing, and that it's becoming more and more viable that one day we'll see big hit games actually played through the browser, for one simple reason; sending a link to someone where they can jump in and start playing with you immediately is a very powerful interaction (not having to wait for downloads etc.). And there are fundamental technological shifts that are making this more and more possible; WebGPU is opening up for more advanced graphics, WASM is making it possible to run near-native code, and WebTransport is making it possible to run more high-demand netcode in games. We're building Ambient on top of all those three, and while it's early days still, we're really excited to see what people can accomplish with them!
jauntywundrkind 3y ago
You say that being web centric precludes usage on conventional gaming platforms. What about all the games that are PC only anyways? They could use Tauri or whatnot & have incredibly easy time porting to native. Games such as Battlefield have already used web technology to power much of the game chrome. Taking this a step further doesn't seem like a real constraint. Microsoft themselves are working to extend fast performance webviews to Xbox uwp's. https://github.com/MicrosoftEdge/WebView2Feedback/issues/2155 https://github.com/MicrosoftEdge/WebView2Feedback/issues/215... You're also not acknowledging the upside. Plenty of games would love to have an easy-to-make runs-anywhere multi-parryty game. Letting people log in from work or their phone could be a huge advantage to reaching markets. The market of people with access to web browsers is much bigger than the market of console owners! You're also constraining your thinking to a narrow band in other ways, again ignoring plenty of great potential. Unreal has had huge success gaining entry into all kinds of unexpected spaces; cinema, architecture, events. Engines have a much wider market than just games, and having engines available on a much broader set of modalities than conventional game engines can unlock new use cases. No one's going to build a navigation tool requiring everyone to have a Steam Deck, but if all it takes is a phone then maybe that becomes interesting. This also seems like an amazing starter kit for education and hobby coders. Wouldn't it be amazing to be able to be a year or two into learning development, and be able to create your own virtual world? That anyone can easily join & access from any device? That potential makes me thrilled. Maybe this innovation isn't for you & you want to stick to conventional modalities. Fine, great! Don't use this. I for one see a lot of potential & reason for excitement. I think it has plenty of revenue potential, and vast amounts of cool potential.

FredrikNoren 3y ago

So we view the browser as one distribution channel among many. We want Ambient to run everywhere. The first platforms we built out Ambient for were actually desktop native, we've since then also added the web support. That said, we do believe that the web _is_ changing, and that it's becoming more and more viable that one day we'll see big hit games actually played through the browser, for one simple reason; sending a link to someone where they can jump in and start playing with you immediately is a very powerful interaction (not having to wait for downloads etc.). And there are fundamental technological shifts that are making this more and more possible; WebGPU is opening up for more advanced graphics, WASM is making it possible to run near-native code, and WebTransport is making it possible to run more high-demand netcode in games. We're building Ambient on top of all those three, and while it's early days still, we're really excited to see what people can accomplish with them!

jauntywundrkind 3y ago

You say that being web centric precludes usage on conventional gaming platforms. What about all the games that are PC only anyways? They could use Tauri or whatnot & have incredibly easy time porting to native. Games such as Battlefield have already used web technology to power much of the game chrome. Taking this a step further doesn't seem like a real constraint. Microsoft themselves are working to extend fast performance webviews to Xbox uwp's. https://github.com/MicrosoftEdge/WebView2Feedback/issues/2155 https://github.com/MicrosoftEdge/WebView2Feedback/issues/215... You're also not acknowledging the upside. Plenty of games would love to have an easy-to-make runs-anywhere multi-parryty game. Letting people log in from work or their phone could be a huge advantage to reaching markets. The market of people with access to web browsers is much bigger than the market of console owners! You're also constraining your thinking to a narrow band in other ways, again ignoring plenty of great potential. Unreal has had huge success gaining entry into all kinds of unexpected spaces; cinema, architecture, events. Engines have a much wider market than just games, and having engines available on a much broader set of modalities than conventional game engines can unlock new use cases. No one's going to build a navigation tool requiring everyone to have a Steam Deck, but if all it takes is a phone then maybe that becomes interesting. This also seems like an amazing starter kit for education and hobby coders. Wouldn't it be amazing to be able to be a year or two into learning development, and be able to create your own virtual world? That anyone can easily join & access from any device? That potential makes me thrilled. Maybe this innovation isn't for you & you want to stick to conventional modalities. Fine, great! Don't use this. I for one see a lot of potential & reason for excitement. I think it has plenty of revenue potential, and vast amounts of cool potential.