3 ms·

The story of "operation acoustic kitty" being squashed by a taxi is presented without skepticism; they don't mention that > this was disputed in 2013 by Robert

The story of "operation acoustic kitty" being squashed by a taxi is presented without skepticism; they don't mention that > this was disputed in 2013 by Robert Wallace, a former director of the Office of Technical Service, who said that the project was abandoned due to the difficulty of training the cat to behave as required, and "the equipment was taken out of the cat; the cat was re-sewn for a second time, and lived a long and happy life afterwards".

throwanem 3y ago
Well, he would say that, wouldn't he? Jokes aside, I don't know how to feel about that one. It's just so nonsensically stupid and absurd, on the one hand, but on the other how much does that really make it stand out among the CIA era with which it's contemporaneous? But merely that it's plausible seems indictment enough.
- throwawayq3423 3y ago
  Well ok, doesn't the author have the motivation to keep their narrative consistent as well?
  - throwanem 3y ago
    This article is far from the only source, including some from within the agency, to provide a relatively credulous account of "Project Acoustic Kitty".
    - throwawayq3423 3y ago
      Why doesn't he, or you, cite them ?
      - throwanem 3y ago
        I don't know why the article author didn't, aside from that this doesn't seem the sort of journal where that level of bibliography is common. For my own sake, because this has been out there for a couple decades at least, and I trust you are at least as able as I am to find all the sources you desire - and without needing to suspect I might've hand-picked mine to support my thesis, besides.
        throwawayq3423 3y ago
        It's not my responsibility to verify your claims, it's yours.
        throwanem 3y ago
        It's not my responsibility to support your arguments.
        throwawayq3423 3y ago
        If you make a claim, you should be able to stand behind it, by citing it. Responding with circular logic about who's responsibility it is to actual research is counter productive, and giving the appearance that you don't actual have a citation to back up what you are saying at all.
        throwanem 3y ago
        Yeah, and commenting on HN while I'm in a bitchy mood isn't especially productive either. I don't have my copy of The Wizards of Langley immediately to hand, but that's where I remember first seeing details of the project, ages back. When I get the chance I'll see what that has for further reference; given the time of its publication, I suspect a lot of other sources derive at least in part from there.
- mrguyorama 3y ago
  Why is it "so nonsensically stupid and absurd"? This was an era before you could just deploy a tiny quad copter. In WW2 we used live bats in bombs to start fires. We taught certain birds to peck TV screens to guide missiles. We tried to teach dogs to find land mines and dive under tanks so we could explode them. We thought of using live chickens to keep nuclear land mines warm for long enough to be effective. There was an era where "lets make a small animal do it" was the technology of the day, and it overlapped with "lets turn everything into a listening device for the [soviet|american] embassy"
  - throwanem 3y ago
    Yes, and aside from predating the CIA thing by two decades, none of those other projects produced anything worth a damn either. That includes the strict subset that made it so far as an attempt at implementation - and I note also none of the projects you list involved cats, famously the least biddable among animals common in both household and farmstead. Even Skinner was more sensible than that! So I suppose I have to thank you for making such a strong argument in support, however unintentionally.

throwanem 3y ago

Well, he would say that, wouldn't he? Jokes aside, I don't know how to feel about that one. It's just so nonsensically stupid and absurd, on the one hand, but on the other how much does that really make it stand out among the CIA era with which it's contemporaneous? But merely that it's plausible seems indictment enough.

throwawayq3423 3y ago
Well ok, doesn't the author have the motivation to keep their narrative consistent as well?
- throwanem 3y ago
  This article is far from the only source, including some from within the agency, to provide a relatively credulous account of "Project Acoustic Kitty".
  - throwawayq3423 3y ago
    Why doesn't he, or you, cite them ?
    - throwanem 3y ago
      I don't know why the article author didn't, aside from that this doesn't seem the sort of journal where that level of bibliography is common. For my own sake, because this has been out there for a couple decades at least, and I trust you are at least as able as I am to find all the sources you desire - and without needing to suspect I might've hand-picked mine to support my thesis, besides.
      - throwawayq3423 3y ago
        It's not my responsibility to verify your claims, it's yours.
        throwanem 3y ago
        It's not my responsibility to support your arguments.
        throwawayq3423 3y ago
        If you make a claim, you should be able to stand behind it, by citing it. Responding with circular logic about who's responsibility it is to actual research is counter productive, and giving the appearance that you don't actual have a citation to back up what you are saying at all.
        throwanem 3y ago
        Yeah, and commenting on HN while I'm in a bitchy mood isn't especially productive either. I don't have my copy of The Wizards of Langley immediately to hand, but that's where I remember first seeing details of the project, ages back. When I get the chance I'll see what that has for further reference; given the time of its publication, I suspect a lot of other sources derive at least in part from there.
mrguyorama 3y ago
Why is it "so nonsensically stupid and absurd"? This was an era before you could just deploy a tiny quad copter. In WW2 we used live bats in bombs to start fires. We taught certain birds to peck TV screens to guide missiles. We tried to teach dogs to find land mines and dive under tanks so we could explode them. We thought of using live chickens to keep nuclear land mines warm for long enough to be effective. There was an era where "lets make a small animal do it" was the technology of the day, and it overlapped with "lets turn everything into a listening device for the [soviet|american] embassy"
- throwanem 3y ago
  Yes, and aside from predating the CIA thing by two decades, none of those other projects produced anything worth a damn either. That includes the strict subset that made it so far as an attempt at implementation - and I note also none of the projects you list involved cats, famously the least biddable among animals common in both household and farmstead. Even Skinner was more sensible than that! So I suppose I have to thank you for making such a strong argument in support, however unintentionally.