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60 Minutes had a program where they looked at cars that did not stop when you press the break. And all of their tests, no matter what, even if they were holding

60 Minutes had a program where they looked at cars that did not stop when you press the break. And all of their tests, no matter what, even if they were holding down the gas pedal, pressing the break, brings the car to a stop. Unless there is shown to be a physical defect or fault that prevented the brakes engaging, I am inclined to believe the driver is at fault.

pjc50 3y ago
Was this the good old "Toyota unintended acceleration" fiasco? I still don't know who to believe on that one.
giantg2 3y ago
"Unless there is shown to be a physical defect or fault that prevented the brakes engaging, I am inclined to believe the driver is at fault." What about an electronic defect? That's the interesting part to me - you're relying on the data logs from a system for court which in theory might not match what actually happened and may not leave an observable physical defect. For example but not specific to this case, if there was an error that actuated a brake through the traction control system but it wasn't recorded due to the initiating error.
michaelt 3y ago
I'm sympathetic to car manufacturers in situations of very brief unintended acceleration, where the driver could plausibly have hit the accelerator instead of the brake, or something loose in the car could have got stuck under one of the pedals. But in this case, the problem lasted long enough for the driver to call the police, and a convoy of police vehicles to escort him for some 15 minutes. To me it sounds like the driver's reaction was calm and controlled, with plenty of time to assess the situation. Another report on the same incident [1] says the driver tried the park button, the engine off button, police got advice from engineers, they even tried passing the car key to another car. And that the dash showed "nine warning lights." Given these facts, it seems very unlikely the driver was, for example, confusing the accelerator and the brake, or failing to press the brake sufficiently hard. [1] https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-vehicle-car-brakes-malfunction-glasgow-police/ https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-ve...
- Pulcinella 3y ago
  Time to make a phone call doesn't necessarily mean anything. This poor family[0] had time to call 911 and still crashed. https://www.twincities.com/2010/02/23/a-lexus-barreling-out-of-control-a-frantic-911-call-a-family-dead/amp/ https://www.twincities.com/2010/02/23/a-lexus-barreling-out-...
  - EricE 3y ago
    It wasn't just time to make the phone call - it was time to make the call, police respond, get the manufacturer on the phone too, and then 15 minutes in to the response taking the final action.
d1sxeyes 3y ago
The article says that the driver was met by a convoy of police cars and then after a 15 minute drive around with the police escort, they did a rolling stop. I could imagine someone making a mistake and accidentally pressing the wrong pedal, etc., but it seems very unlikely that after 15 minutes at 15mph in a police convoy, the guy still couldn’t work out how to press the brake pedal properly.
reaperman 3y ago
https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-vehicle-car-brakes-malfunction-glasgow-police/ https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-ve... > Police worked with their engineers and tried everything to bring the EV motor to a stop. Your thoughts?

pjc50 3y ago

Was this the good old "Toyota unintended acceleration" fiasco? I still don't know who to believe on that one.

giantg2 3y ago

"Unless there is shown to be a physical defect or fault that prevented the brakes engaging, I am inclined to believe the driver is at fault." What about an electronic defect? That's the interesting part to me - you're relying on the data logs from a system for court which in theory might not match what actually happened and may not leave an observable physical defect. For example but not specific to this case, if there was an error that actuated a brake through the traction control system but it wasn't recorded due to the initiating error.

michaelt 3y ago

I'm sympathetic to car manufacturers in situations of very brief unintended acceleration, where the driver could plausibly have hit the accelerator instead of the brake, or something loose in the car could have got stuck under one of the pedals. But in this case, the problem lasted long enough for the driver to call the police, and a convoy of police vehicles to escort him for some 15 minutes. To me it sounds like the driver's reaction was calm and controlled, with plenty of time to assess the situation. Another report on the same incident [1] says the driver tried the park button, the engine off button, police got advice from engineers, they even tried passing the car key to another car. And that the dash showed "nine warning lights." Given these facts, it seems very unlikely the driver was, for example, confusing the accelerator and the brake, or failing to press the brake sufficiently hard. [1] https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-vehicle-car-brakes-malfunction-glasgow-police/ https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-ve...

Pulcinella 3y ago
Time to make a phone call doesn't necessarily mean anything. This poor family[0] had time to call 911 and still crashed. https://www.twincities.com/2010/02/23/a-lexus-barreling-out-of-control-a-frantic-911-call-a-family-dead/amp/ https://www.twincities.com/2010/02/23/a-lexus-barreling-out-...
- EricE 3y ago
  It wasn't just time to make the phone call - it was time to make the call, police respond, get the manufacturer on the phone too, and then 15 minutes in to the response taking the final action.

d1sxeyes 3y ago

The article says that the driver was met by a convoy of police cars and then after a 15 minute drive around with the police escort, they did a rolling stop. I could imagine someone making a mistake and accidentally pressing the wrong pedal, etc., but it seems very unlikely that after 15 minutes at 15mph in a police convoy, the guy still couldn’t work out how to press the brake pedal properly.

reaperman 3y ago

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-vehicle-car-brakes-malfunction-glasgow-police/ https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/motors/11320530/electric-ve... > Police worked with their engineers and tried everything to bring the EV motor to a stop. Your thoughts?