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I find this take so interesting. Here's a tool so faultless your biggest gripe with it is some obscure interaction 99.99% of people wont even be aware of, and y

by lijok 3y ago

I find this take so interesting. Here's a tool so faultless your biggest gripe with it is some obscure interaction 99.99% of people wont even be aware of, and you want to replace the tool because of it. This would be the equivalent of me buying a great car and disliking the fact that when you pull the carpets up there's a hard to reach clip that needs to be undone, so I decide to sell it and get a different car. I see this happen with all great tools. It irons out all the important kinks, and people still find some obscure reason to fault the tool enough to switch. (To be clear, I am aware Docker has issues beyond what GP is dealing with) (Apologies for the strong tone of the comment, it's not intended, but could not find a better way to word it)

NhanH 3y ago
That is not an obscure issue. The common manifestation is breaking iptables rule (with expose port) and messing up software firewall has caused a lot of wasted hours and security issues.
- insanitybit 3y ago
  And yet the example they chose was "It broke wifi on a train's shitty network"
  - codetrotter 3y ago
    Docker uses 172.17.0.0/16 subnet range by default. There is nothing shitty about the network on the train for also using this same IP address range. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_network https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_network 10.0.0.0/8 172.16.0.0/12 192.168.0.0/16 You might be used to seeing addresses from 192.168.0.0/24 and 192.168.1.0/24 in home networks, and addresses from 10.x.y.0/24 in corporate internal networks. But all of 172.16.0.0/12 has exactly the same kind of purpose as do 10.0.0.0/8 and 192.168.0.0/16. The people that set up the network on the train did nothing wrong for using a subnet of 172.16.0.0/12.
    - justin_oaks 3y ago
      Does anyone configure other IP ranges in Docker? I know there are other reserved IP ranges you might get away with. There's the CGNAT IP range 100.64.0.0/10, and there's the link-local IP range 169.254.0.0/16. These are unused in most situations and may work fine for Docker networks.
      - doubled112 3y ago
        I do. I have a few VLANs and subnets at home. Docker Compose creates a new network for every project, and eventually overlaps with something important. They are fairly large ranges by default, so you end up taking up a lot of address space fast if you're not careful. This is especially wasteful because some of the Docker networks only contain two hosts, but are (from memory) a /24 or maybe even a /20. Easier to handle it manually.
adammarples 3y ago
Surely the exact equivalent issue would be that the car is always running and sometimes blocks your WiFi when it's in the garage
- lijok 3y ago
  Very different implication there, so I would say it's not equivalent

by lijok 3y ago

NhanH 3y ago

That is not an obscure issue. The common manifestation is breaking iptables rule (with expose port) and messing up software firewall has caused a lot of wasted hours and security issues.

insanitybit 3y ago
And yet the example they chose was "It broke wifi on a train's shitty network"
- codetrotter 3y ago
  Docker uses 172.17.0.0/16 subnet range by default. There is nothing shitty about the network on the train for also using this same IP address range. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_network https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_network 10.0.0.0/8 172.16.0.0/12 192.168.0.0/16 You might be used to seeing addresses from 192.168.0.0/24 and 192.168.1.0/24 in home networks, and addresses from 10.x.y.0/24 in corporate internal networks. But all of 172.16.0.0/12 has exactly the same kind of purpose as do 10.0.0.0/8 and 192.168.0.0/16. The people that set up the network on the train did nothing wrong for using a subnet of 172.16.0.0/12.
  - justin_oaks 3y ago
    Does anyone configure other IP ranges in Docker? I know there are other reserved IP ranges you might get away with. There's the CGNAT IP range 100.64.0.0/10, and there's the link-local IP range 169.254.0.0/16. These are unused in most situations and may work fine for Docker networks.
    - doubled112 3y ago
      I do. I have a few VLANs and subnets at home. Docker Compose creates a new network for every project, and eventually overlaps with something important. They are fairly large ranges by default, so you end up taking up a lot of address space fast if you're not careful. This is especially wasteful because some of the Docker networks only contain two hosts, but are (from memory) a /24 or maybe even a /20. Easier to handle it manually.

adammarples 3y ago

Surely the exact equivalent issue would be that the car is always running and sometimes blocks your WiFi when it's in the garage

lijok 3y ago
Very different implication there, so I would say it's not equivalent