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I just went through a job search. It is absolutely normal to be ghosted. „Feedback next week.“ And one third interviewers went silent. Even no answer when askin

by lnsru 3y ago

I just went through a job search. It is absolutely normal to be ghosted. „Feedback next week.“ And one third interviewers went silent. Even no answer when asking. Is it hard for a tech company to implement automatic “no” e-mail with default template to be sent after one month inactivity?.. It would hurt if I were less confident in my abilities.

simbolit 3y ago
LOL, there has been an article on German news[1] yesterday about HR people complaining about job applicants increasingly "ghosting" them. The Reddit thread about it[2] was basically all "got a taste of your own medicine"... [1, German language] https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/arbeitsmarkt/ghosting-bewerbung-arbeitsplatz-100.html https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/arbeitsmarkt/ghosting-b... [2, German language] https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/16yxopw/ghosting_in_der_arbeitswelt_wenn_jobbewerber/ https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/16yxopw/ghosting_in_der...
- somedude895 3y ago
  Yeah that's a terrible attitude to have. We've made that experience as well with a younger applicant, where after the first interview we wanted to invite her to meet the team and she just never replied. She turned up at the office a couple months later having found a job at a different team. Needless to say, her reputation was instantly tarnished after the other team learned about that. Every company / team is different, and we never ghost applicants. If you're just gonna be an asshole because you had a negative experience yourself, it's a sign of a weak character and you can also really shoot yourself in the foot. That's not limited to job hunting either, but applies to any social relationship as well.
  - simbolit 3y ago
    I don't know about your German skills, but reading the Reddit threat may be eye-opening (even if your company is different). I generally agree with your "gonna be an asshole because you had a negative experience yourself" comment, but reading the comments it more seems like corporate HR (as a whole across virtually all companies) has fostered a culture of broadly ghosting job applicants. If you experienced this once, your comment applies, but if you experienced it a couple dozen times (as some people in the thread have), then I don't think your "weak character" judgement is accurate. It is more "learning how things are done here", with "here" being the job applications space.
    - somedude895 3y ago
      I understand how people who only just enter the workforce might see all employers as some sort of monolithic entity, and maybe go into a sort of "fuck em" kind of mindset, especially if they hang around on Reddit (which is never a good and reasonable source of advice let's be honest), but you really do yourself a disservice. I get it. It's frustrating coming out of university and getting shot down left and right, and sometimes not in a nice way. Even so, I still believe that you should always do what you think is the right thing to do, rather than give up on your principles because those around you seem to not act in kind. It's the same with dating (which TFA is about). I couldn't look at myself in the mirror if I started ghosting people just because I get ghosted regularly (which I do). Just be a decent person and don't let what others do affect you. It's dignified and much healthier for yourself as well if you're above others' bad behaviour.
      - nuancebydefault 3y ago
        My opinion is that this is the one and only right approach. From my experience, every company/HR/reviewer is different in culture/personality. Also, the culture of the company is sometimes reflected in its outside behavior. "Glad they didn't hire me".
nonrandomstring 3y ago
That's not ghosting, that's lying. It makes an explicit promise of future communication which it then reneges on. It's cowardly, and shitty, and unfortunately normalised in corporate culture. And we've talked here on HN about whether it's acceptable to, in retaliation, simply ghost an employer who offered you a job after a better offer transpired. I think the consensus generally is that taking the moral high-ground is the mark of a professional, indeed a decent and dignified person.
- FormerBandmate 3y ago
  In retaliation to who? Not all employers are an amorphous blob who are responsible for each other, and ghosting Walgreens because CVS ghosted you doesn’t really make any sense. This arms race just degrades professionalism tbh
  - nonrandomstring 3y ago
    > In retaliation to who? Exactly. This is a complicated psycho-dynamic. Prejudice against some member of group because another (perceived) member of that group wronged you is a road to ruins. As if "employers" were all of one mind. It's like kicking some random car in the street because the one ahead of it honked at you. However, behaviours are shared by example and through culture. (and lack of challenge). It becomes normal to simply lie to a jobseeker's face "We'll call you next week". And after a few experiences of that one cannot deny or begrudge negative expectations that emerge. What is needed is adaptation and robust challenge that calls out the lie (everyone now knows it's a lie). Something like: Interviewer: "Hey great. We'll call you next week", You: "So I didn't get the job?" Interviewer: "Errr. What do you mean? I said we'd call you next week" You: "Ah, but everybody knows what that means. You probably won't call me. Because you have 100 people to call. I can see you're a busy guy. If I agree to wait for your call, and you forget, that could make you look like a liar. And I don't want to think that about you." Interviewer: "......" You: "So how about I'll call you! If I still want the job. Plus that will save you money on the call. How about Wednesday morning at 10?" If they balk, you can walk and at least know the score. But if they agree, even tacitly, stick to it and call-in on time. When confronted with weak behaviour taking ownership and responsibility seems the only dignified way to avoid becoming jaded and prejudiced. Take away their ability to lie to you, and you won't have to suffer diasppointment,

by lnsru 3y ago

simbolit 3y ago

LOL, there has been an article on German news[1] yesterday about HR people complaining about job applicants increasingly "ghosting" them. The Reddit thread about it[2] was basically all "got a taste of your own medicine"... [1, German language] https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/arbeitsmarkt/ghosting-bewerbung-arbeitsplatz-100.html https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/arbeitsmarkt/ghosting-b... [2, German language] https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/16yxopw/ghosting_in_der_arbeitswelt_wenn_jobbewerber/ https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/16yxopw/ghosting_in_der...

somedude895 3y ago
Yeah that's a terrible attitude to have. We've made that experience as well with a younger applicant, where after the first interview we wanted to invite her to meet the team and she just never replied. She turned up at the office a couple months later having found a job at a different team. Needless to say, her reputation was instantly tarnished after the other team learned about that. Every company / team is different, and we never ghost applicants. If you're just gonna be an asshole because you had a negative experience yourself, it's a sign of a weak character and you can also really shoot yourself in the foot. That's not limited to job hunting either, but applies to any social relationship as well.
- simbolit 3y ago
  I don't know about your German skills, but reading the Reddit threat may be eye-opening (even if your company is different). I generally agree with your "gonna be an asshole because you had a negative experience yourself" comment, but reading the comments it more seems like corporate HR (as a whole across virtually all companies) has fostered a culture of broadly ghosting job applicants. If you experienced this once, your comment applies, but if you experienced it a couple dozen times (as some people in the thread have), then I don't think your "weak character" judgement is accurate. It is more "learning how things are done here", with "here" being the job applications space.
  - somedude895 3y ago
    I understand how people who only just enter the workforce might see all employers as some sort of monolithic entity, and maybe go into a sort of "fuck em" kind of mindset, especially if they hang around on Reddit (which is never a good and reasonable source of advice let's be honest), but you really do yourself a disservice. I get it. It's frustrating coming out of university and getting shot down left and right, and sometimes not in a nice way. Even so, I still believe that you should always do what you think is the right thing to do, rather than give up on your principles because those around you seem to not act in kind. It's the same with dating (which TFA is about). I couldn't look at myself in the mirror if I started ghosting people just because I get ghosted regularly (which I do). Just be a decent person and don't let what others do affect you. It's dignified and much healthier for yourself as well if you're above others' bad behaviour.
    - nuancebydefault 3y ago
      My opinion is that this is the one and only right approach. From my experience, every company/HR/reviewer is different in culture/personality. Also, the culture of the company is sometimes reflected in its outside behavior. "Glad they didn't hire me".

nonrandomstring 3y ago

That's not ghosting, that's lying. It makes an explicit promise of future communication which it then reneges on. It's cowardly, and shitty, and unfortunately normalised in corporate culture. And we've talked here on HN about whether it's acceptable to, in retaliation, simply ghost an employer who offered you a job after a better offer transpired. I think the consensus generally is that taking the moral high-ground is the mark of a professional, indeed a decent and dignified person.

FormerBandmate 3y ago
In retaliation to who? Not all employers are an amorphous blob who are responsible for each other, and ghosting Walgreens because CVS ghosted you doesn’t really make any sense. This arms race just degrades professionalism tbh
- nonrandomstring 3y ago
  > In retaliation to who? Exactly. This is a complicated psycho-dynamic. Prejudice against some member of group because another (perceived) member of that group wronged you is a road to ruins. As if "employers" were all of one mind. It's like kicking some random car in the street because the one ahead of it honked at you. However, behaviours are shared by example and through culture. (and lack of challenge). It becomes normal to simply lie to a jobseeker's face "We'll call you next week". And after a few experiences of that one cannot deny or begrudge negative expectations that emerge. What is needed is adaptation and robust challenge that calls out the lie (everyone now knows it's a lie). Something like: Interviewer: "Hey great. We'll call you next week", You: "So I didn't get the job?" Interviewer: "Errr. What do you mean? I said we'd call you next week" You: "Ah, but everybody knows what that means. You probably won't call me. Because you have 100 people to call. I can see you're a busy guy. If I agree to wait for your call, and you forget, that could make you look like a liar. And I don't want to think that about you." Interviewer: "......" You: "So how about I'll call you! If I still want the job. Plus that will save you money on the call. How about Wednesday morning at 10?" If they balk, you can walk and at least know the score. But if they agree, even tacitly, stick to it and call-in on time. When confronted with weak behaviour taking ownership and responsibility seems the only dignified way to avoid becoming jaded and prejudiced. Take away their ability to lie to you, and you won't have to suffer diasppointment,