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Apparently 8 with some gotchas? But in principle this should not be gated to a hardware, what is stopping one from making a bluetooth device that muxes all the

Apparently 8 with some gotchas? But in principle this should not be gated to a hardware, what is stopping one from making a bluetooth device that muxes all the signals and sends it to the audio device? Is there any reason thats not happening other than greed of the headphone makers to try to upsell "higher models"?

scarface_74 3y ago
“8 with some gotchas”. That’s a rousing endorsement of open standards.
- donkeybeer 3y ago
  Its not open enough. If it was open enough I could feed it any signal I want into the audio interface, including from any bluetooth device to MUX them how I want.
- smoldesu 3y ago
  You have no idea what you're talking about. 1. Your Bluetooth radio determines how many simultaneous connections you get. It is at least 2 on Bluetooth 4.0+. 2. You are conflating cloud pairing (Apple's feature) with multipoint pairing (everyone's feature). They coexist. 3. 8 devices is generally the hard limit on all consumer Bluetooth radios, from the iPhone to Nintendo Switch.
  - scarface_74 3y ago
    Yes, that’s true if you rely on the “open” standard. Luckily I don’t have to because I use an integrated solution where the hardware, software and OS are made by the same company. We aren’t talking about “simultaneous” connections we are talking about switching between them. I’m not “confusing” anything. I’m saying that Apple’s integrated solution provides a better user experience. No one cares about how it’s done . Thanks for making my point for me.
    - smoldesu 3y ago
      Quite literally, the only point you have made is that iCloud can store Bluetooth MAC addresses across devices. > No one cares about how it’s done . Some markets do: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A32022R1925 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A... Next though, you'll tell me that those democratically elected officials aren't "people", and are more profit-motivated than a business. Whatever helps you sleep at night, I suppose.
      - scarface_74 3y ago
        Again, why do I care why it happens. Your “open” standards leads to a shittier experience. > Next though, you'll tell me that those democratically elected officials aren't "people", and are more profit-motivated than a business. Whatever helps you sleep at night, I suppose It’s cute that you think politicians represent “the people” considering how PACs work or that you think they are “democratically” elected considering how gerrymandered most districts are. Then you got to consider how each state has an equal number of senators regardless of population.
        smoldesu 3y ago
        > Again, why do I care why it happens. Your “open” standards leads to a shittier experience. Again, why do you? Apple's products have worked just fine implimenting open standards (eg. HTML, TLS, AES, RSA, etc.). You could easily argue that the iPhone wouldn't be popular without open standards like Bluetooth and the Internet. > It’s cute that you think politicians represent “the people” Does the unregulated market represent it any better? I'd rather let gerrymandered electors regulate the market than allow the market to regulate itself.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Apple products work fine working on top of those standards and adding its own features where it can make sure those features work consistently because it is an integrated environment. Well, if I have a choice between a corporation - which I can choose not to support and a government with guns and the ability to take away my rights by force having power, I’ll choose private corporations every time.
  - donkeybeer 3y ago
    I don't even get the point of these hardcore Apple defenders tbh man. You are not Apple, and you only gain to benefit from if supposedly they have good hardware and software, it also becomes more open for you or others to find better uses for it. You only gain not lose from that. Here on an HN linked article I was reading how Asahi managed to find and fix some audio bug in a macbook model. When multiple people are working on drivers often the foss can end up being superior to the drivers made by the manufacturer.
    - scarface_74 3y ago
      So every single “open” standard seems to suck compared to the integrated solution.
      - donkeybeer 3y ago
        What do you gain from it remaining closed? Why are you so defensive about the idea of Apple being forced to open it up? Are you an Apple employee or do you have Apple stocks or is there any other reason? You lose literally nothing and gain lots from them being opened up. I don't care about any "trouble" Apple has with it because I am not Apple. I am a person who thinks of his needs first, just as Apple is an entity that thinks of their needs first. They don't need your help for that. Just like Apple my needs come first, and my needs definitely think its more enjoyable to see Apple (and other hardware makers) opened up because it benefits me. I always advocate for and practice things that benefit me, I don't care if it benefits Apple, if it does, good for them, if it doesn't its not my problem either. And Apple thinks the same of you and me and all is customers.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Well, the first thing I gain is a non shitty way of using Bluetooth headphones without “some gotchas”.
        smoldesu 3y ago
        You get that with or without Apple technology. There's not a single 'gotcha' you've named yet. Furthermore, Apple's integrated solution quite literally depends on the Open standard of Bluetooth to operate. Whether or not you consider it a bad thing, quite obviously the integration and open solution both work fine alongside one another.

scarface_74 3y ago

“8 with some gotchas”. That’s a rousing endorsement of open standards.

donkeybeer 3y ago
Its not open enough. If it was open enough I could feed it any signal I want into the audio interface, including from any bluetooth device to MUX them how I want.
smoldesu 3y ago
You have no idea what you're talking about. 1. Your Bluetooth radio determines how many simultaneous connections you get. It is at least 2 on Bluetooth 4.0+. 2. You are conflating cloud pairing (Apple's feature) with multipoint pairing (everyone's feature). They coexist. 3. 8 devices is generally the hard limit on all consumer Bluetooth radios, from the iPhone to Nintendo Switch.
- scarface_74 3y ago
  Yes, that’s true if you rely on the “open” standard. Luckily I don’t have to because I use an integrated solution where the hardware, software and OS are made by the same company. We aren’t talking about “simultaneous” connections we are talking about switching between them. I’m not “confusing” anything. I’m saying that Apple’s integrated solution provides a better user experience. No one cares about how it’s done . Thanks for making my point for me.
  - smoldesu 3y ago
    Quite literally, the only point you have made is that iCloud can store Bluetooth MAC addresses across devices. > No one cares about how it’s done . Some markets do: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A32022R1925 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A... Next though, you'll tell me that those democratically elected officials aren't "people", and are more profit-motivated than a business. Whatever helps you sleep at night, I suppose.
    - scarface_74 3y ago
      Again, why do I care why it happens. Your “open” standards leads to a shittier experience. > Next though, you'll tell me that those democratically elected officials aren't "people", and are more profit-motivated than a business. Whatever helps you sleep at night, I suppose It’s cute that you think politicians represent “the people” considering how PACs work or that you think they are “democratically” elected considering how gerrymandered most districts are. Then you got to consider how each state has an equal number of senators regardless of population.
      - smoldesu 3y ago
        > Again, why do I care why it happens. Your “open” standards leads to a shittier experience. Again, why do you? Apple's products have worked just fine implimenting open standards (eg. HTML, TLS, AES, RSA, etc.). You could easily argue that the iPhone wouldn't be popular without open standards like Bluetooth and the Internet. > It’s cute that you think politicians represent “the people” Does the unregulated market represent it any better? I'd rather let gerrymandered electors regulate the market than allow the market to regulate itself.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Apple products work fine working on top of those standards and adding its own features where it can make sure those features work consistently because it is an integrated environment. Well, if I have a choice between a corporation - which I can choose not to support and a government with guns and the ability to take away my rights by force having power, I’ll choose private corporations every time.
- donkeybeer 3y ago
  I don't even get the point of these hardcore Apple defenders tbh man. You are not Apple, and you only gain to benefit from if supposedly they have good hardware and software, it also becomes more open for you or others to find better uses for it. You only gain not lose from that. Here on an HN linked article I was reading how Asahi managed to find and fix some audio bug in a macbook model. When multiple people are working on drivers often the foss can end up being superior to the drivers made by the manufacturer.
  - scarface_74 3y ago
    So every single “open” standard seems to suck compared to the integrated solution.
    - donkeybeer 3y ago
      What do you gain from it remaining closed? Why are you so defensive about the idea of Apple being forced to open it up? Are you an Apple employee or do you have Apple stocks or is there any other reason? You lose literally nothing and gain lots from them being opened up. I don't care about any "trouble" Apple has with it because I am not Apple. I am a person who thinks of his needs first, just as Apple is an entity that thinks of their needs first. They don't need your help for that. Just like Apple my needs come first, and my needs definitely think its more enjoyable to see Apple (and other hardware makers) opened up because it benefits me. I always advocate for and practice things that benefit me, I don't care if it benefits Apple, if it does, good for them, if it doesn't its not my problem either. And Apple thinks the same of you and me and all is customers.
      - scarface_74 3y ago
        Well, the first thing I gain is a non shitty way of using Bluetooth headphones without “some gotchas”.
        smoldesu 3y ago
        You get that with or without Apple technology. There's not a single 'gotcha' you've named yet. Furthermore, Apple's integrated solution quite literally depends on the Open standard of Bluetooth to operate. Whether or not you consider it a bad thing, quite obviously the integration and open solution both work fine alongside one another.