3 ms·

You should go even further and check the video playback experience on apple machines, when divx was all the rage and apple had just a sorrenson video 3. And yea

You should go even further and check the video playback experience on apple machines, when divx was all the rage and apple had just a sorrenson video 3. And yeah, full-screen playback was a qt pro feature, paid extra.

scarface_74 3y ago
Or you can go even further back when Microsoft was caught stealing QT code because they couldn’t do video competently themselves and Apple could (circa 1995). And every Mac geek knew how to work around it either via free third party software or just using AppleScript https://osxdaily.com/2007/01/30/play-quicktime-movies-full-screen-without-quicktime-pro/ https://osxdaily.com/2007/01/30/play-quicktime-movies-full-s...
- vetinari 3y ago
  Nah, they didn't, when Jobs said someone has stealing his code, he meant that someone did something similar. Like "stealing his ideas". Also in 90's, there was no applescript support on macos classic qt, and third party players like vlc didn't exist yet either (not that they ever ran on classic). I know, I was mac user back then and I remember.
  - scarface_74 3y ago
    No, Microsoft actually stole QuickTime code. https://thisdayintechhistory.com/12/06/apple-sues-over-quicktime/ https://thisdayintechhistory.com/12/06/apple-sues-over-quick... Someone doesn’t know their history… Also, the look and feel lawsuit happened before Jobs came back and within a few months after he came back, he settled all of the claims. Your memory is spotty
    - vetinari 3y ago
      I see you don't know how presumption of innocence works. I'm not a fan of Microsoft, but the same applies to them as anyone else. You can be sued for anything, whether true or not. In the court, it must be proven that you did what you are sued for. So it is either proven, or not, and then the court issues the verdict. If it is not, like in Microsoft's case, they are still innocent. It does not matter whether it was impossible to prove or Apple stopped pursing the case; the court said they are guilty. If you continue say they did it, it is a defamation. Even without regarding the above, the case was really shaky. Microsoft using the same vendor through a chain (via Intel) as Apple does not mean they are "stealing". That vendor might learn something from working with them, but that does not imply what you said. Nevermind, that Video for Windows had somewhat different scope (video subsystem), than Quicktime (multimedia subsystem). For Apple, it was simply a negotiation card. Look & feel lawsuit was literally the oh noes, they do similar thing as we do case.
      - scarface_74 3y ago
        Again you don’t know your history. Microsoft paid Apple a settlement fee as part of the overarching deal they made with Apple back in 1997.
        vetinari 3y ago
        The 1997 settlement was about making peace between these two companies. It had nothing to do with the 1994 lawsuit. Btw, the result was that "Apple cannot get patent-like protection for the idea of a graphical user interface, or the idea of a desktop metaphor [under copyright law].." If you want to know how it looks when Microsoft did stole something, look at Stacker. Entirely different evidence, entirely different result, including entirely punishment.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Again, you don’t know your history. https://www.theregister.com/1998/10/29/microsoft_paid_apple_150m/ https://www.theregister.com/1998/10/29/microsoft_paid_apple_... Your batting average isn’t too high on this topic.
  - scarface_74 3y ago
    I just notice you said AppleScript didn’t exist then. It was introduced in 1993.
    - vetinari 3y ago
      I corrected myself; being introduced in 1993 does not mean it was supported by all the Apple utilities since start, at once. Also, it is not an user friendly solution. Do you know, how it really worked? Mac users were sharing QT pro keys. Most had zero interest in the pro features, except full screen playback. It took Apple almost two decades to fix this.
      - scarface_74 3y ago
        It was very well supported. I had a Mac LC II back then. And your previous comments about the history of Apple makes me think that your memory or experience during that time is spotty.
        vetinari 3y ago
        Well supported? Outside of Apple-only SVQ3 and QDM2, it was deserted wasteland. All the videos you could play on PC, it was pita on a Mac. Even if you eventually had divx codec, you had to convert avis to movs. But it is already established in this thread by others, that you have your own, RDF-like experience of what happened; no point in trying to discuss any further.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Yes, it’s my “reality” distortion field that AppleScript wasn’t around until 2000 (which you were wrong about), that the Microsoft settlement didn’t involve QT (which you were wrong about), that Job’s sued MS (which you were wrong about) and that it wasn’t well supported by third parties (you were wrong about that too - I used it to do some automation around MS Office by 1995). Since you didn’t even know that AppleScript existed in 1993, how are you suppose to have any credibility about its history? I actually used it shortly after it was introduced. So what video were you playing on Windows around the time that QT was introduced? Do you know what demo was on the QT 3.5 disk that Apple sent out? Your “facts” are so wrong that you couldn’t have possible been working with Macs when these events occurred.

scarface_74 3y ago

Or you can go even further back when Microsoft was caught stealing QT code because they couldn’t do video competently themselves and Apple could (circa 1995). And every Mac geek knew how to work around it either via free third party software or just using AppleScript https://osxdaily.com/2007/01/30/play-quicktime-movies-full-screen-without-quicktime-pro/ https://osxdaily.com/2007/01/30/play-quicktime-movies-full-s...

vetinari 3y ago
Nah, they didn't, when Jobs said someone has stealing his code, he meant that someone did something similar. Like "stealing his ideas". Also in 90's, there was no applescript support on macos classic qt, and third party players like vlc didn't exist yet either (not that they ever ran on classic). I know, I was mac user back then and I remember.
- scarface_74 3y ago
  No, Microsoft actually stole QuickTime code. https://thisdayintechhistory.com/12/06/apple-sues-over-quicktime/ https://thisdayintechhistory.com/12/06/apple-sues-over-quick... Someone doesn’t know their history… Also, the look and feel lawsuit happened before Jobs came back and within a few months after he came back, he settled all of the claims. Your memory is spotty
  - vetinari 3y ago
    I see you don't know how presumption of innocence works. I'm not a fan of Microsoft, but the same applies to them as anyone else. You can be sued for anything, whether true or not. In the court, it must be proven that you did what you are sued for. So it is either proven, or not, and then the court issues the verdict. If it is not, like in Microsoft's case, they are still innocent. It does not matter whether it was impossible to prove or Apple stopped pursing the case; the court said they are guilty. If you continue say they did it, it is a defamation. Even without regarding the above, the case was really shaky. Microsoft using the same vendor through a chain (via Intel) as Apple does not mean they are "stealing". That vendor might learn something from working with them, but that does not imply what you said. Nevermind, that Video for Windows had somewhat different scope (video subsystem), than Quicktime (multimedia subsystem). For Apple, it was simply a negotiation card. Look & feel lawsuit was literally the oh noes, they do similar thing as we do case.
    - scarface_74 3y ago
      Again you don’t know your history. Microsoft paid Apple a settlement fee as part of the overarching deal they made with Apple back in 1997.
      - vetinari 3y ago
        The 1997 settlement was about making peace between these two companies. It had nothing to do with the 1994 lawsuit. Btw, the result was that "Apple cannot get patent-like protection for the idea of a graphical user interface, or the idea of a desktop metaphor [under copyright law].." If you want to know how it looks when Microsoft did stole something, look at Stacker. Entirely different evidence, entirely different result, including entirely punishment.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Again, you don’t know your history. https://www.theregister.com/1998/10/29/microsoft_paid_apple_150m/ https://www.theregister.com/1998/10/29/microsoft_paid_apple_... Your batting average isn’t too high on this topic.
- scarface_74 3y ago
  I just notice you said AppleScript didn’t exist then. It was introduced in 1993.
  - vetinari 3y ago
    I corrected myself; being introduced in 1993 does not mean it was supported by all the Apple utilities since start, at once. Also, it is not an user friendly solution. Do you know, how it really worked? Mac users were sharing QT pro keys. Most had zero interest in the pro features, except full screen playback. It took Apple almost two decades to fix this.
    - scarface_74 3y ago
      It was very well supported. I had a Mac LC II back then. And your previous comments about the history of Apple makes me think that your memory or experience during that time is spotty.
      - vetinari 3y ago
        Well supported? Outside of Apple-only SVQ3 and QDM2, it was deserted wasteland. All the videos you could play on PC, it was pita on a Mac. Even if you eventually had divx codec, you had to convert avis to movs. But it is already established in this thread by others, that you have your own, RDF-like experience of what happened; no point in trying to discuss any further.
        scarface_74 3y ago
        Yes, it’s my “reality” distortion field that AppleScript wasn’t around until 2000 (which you were wrong about), that the Microsoft settlement didn’t involve QT (which you were wrong about), that Job’s sued MS (which you were wrong about) and that it wasn’t well supported by third parties (you were wrong about that too - I used it to do some automation around MS Office by 1995). Since you didn’t even know that AppleScript existed in 1993, how are you suppose to have any credibility about its history? I actually used it shortly after it was introduced. So what video were you playing on Windows around the time that QT was introduced? Do you know what demo was on the QT 3.5 disk that Apple sent out? Your “facts” are so wrong that you couldn’t have possible been working with Macs when these events occurred.