4 ms·

1950s: "This teenager girl is "hysterical", let's put an ice pick through her eye socket" 2020s: "This teenager girl is depressed, lets cut off her breasts and

by euos 3y ago

1950s: "This teenager girl is "hysterical", let's put an ice pick through her eye socket" 2020s: "This teenager girl is depressed, lets cut off her breasts and pump her full of testosterone"

spondylosaurus 3y ago
If you seriously can't/won't see the difference between an ice pick lobotomy and (voluntary, lifesaving) gender-affirming care then I don't know how to help you.
- pentao 3y ago
  Rephrasing with a euphemism still doesn't make it appropriate to inflict upon children, who are really far too young (some only 12 years old) to consent, such serious surgical interventions that cause them lifelong damage.
  - spondylosaurus 3y ago
    You really made a throwaway just to spread far-right talking points about trans kids? Christ, dude. Also twelve-year olds are not routinely getting gender-affirming surgery, full stop. Most twelve year olds don't even have complete secondary sex characteristics yet. How are you going to get top surgery if you barely have breasts?
    - pentao 3y ago
      [flagged]
    - euos 3y ago
      As a proud Republican, you calling some point of view "far right" does not automatically invalidate it, no matter what you think. Dismissing alternative opinions makes you seem bigotted, not more intelligent.
- euos 3y ago
  Blood letting and lobotomies were believed to be "life-saving" and grounded in science. I am willing to bet there had been quite a few kids with mental issues that received lobotomy back then would end up getting "gender affirming" care nowadays. Based on detrans stories online I do not believe these procedures are "voluntary". Coercion seems common. At least that's what had been said in Congress under the oath.
  - spondylosaurus 3y ago
    You mean the people testifying before Congress who were later linked to a small Evangelical astroturfing movement seeking to push anti-trans legislation across the country? https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/anti-trans-transgender-health-care-ban-legislation-bill-minors-children-lgbtq/ https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/anti-trans-tran... Including one "detrans" activist who disavowed her former anti-trans stance, describing it as a form of self-harm, and then went on to retransition? https://elisashupe.wordpress.com/2022/03/03/elisa-shupe-setting-the-record-straight-about-james-shupe/ https://elisashupe.wordpress.com/2022/03/03/elisa-shupe-sett... > Radical and gender-critical feminists, conservatives, and faith-based groups would like everyone to believe that gender dysphoria can be cured simply by adopting dangerous beliefs. They want you to think that praying, undergoing conversion therapy, etc., can cure and change you. I can attest that all of their treatments failed to work in my case. Publicly, I sustained during that tenuous time by lying to myself and others that what they said worked. I also shamefully sold their ideologies to the media and the public while overdosing on estrogen supplements in private, trying to desperately lower my testosterone level. My actions resulted in a dangerous blood clot which threatened my health and life. Starting HRT is the single best thing I've ever done for my mental health. You choosing to believe that this is a form of coercion, or mutilation, or lobotomizing stands in direct opposition to established medical practice and countless personal testimonies. (And I should hope you can recognize that modern medical practice is far more advanced than the medicine practiced by Victorian-era bloodletting practioners.) The regret rate for gender-affirmating surgical care is about 1% btw. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ That's less than the regret rate for hip replacement surgery, which is about 7%. https://arthroplasty.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s42836-019-0007-3 https://arthroplasty.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s428...

by euos 3y ago

1950s: "This teenager girl is "hysterical", let's put an ice pick through her eye socket" 2020s: "This teenager girl is depressed, lets cut off her breasts and pump her full of testosterone"

spondylosaurus 3y ago

If you seriously can't/won't see the difference between an ice pick lobotomy and (voluntary, lifesaving) gender-affirming care then I don't know how to help you.

pentao 3y ago
Rephrasing with a euphemism still doesn't make it appropriate to inflict upon children, who are really far too young (some only 12 years old) to consent, such serious surgical interventions that cause them lifelong damage.
- spondylosaurus 3y ago
  You really made a throwaway just to spread far-right talking points about trans kids? Christ, dude. Also twelve-year olds are not routinely getting gender-affirming surgery, full stop. Most twelve year olds don't even have complete secondary sex characteristics yet. How are you going to get top surgery if you barely have breasts?
  - pentao 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - euos 3y ago
    As a proud Republican, you calling some point of view "far right" does not automatically invalidate it, no matter what you think. Dismissing alternative opinions makes you seem bigotted, not more intelligent.
euos 3y ago
Blood letting and lobotomies were believed to be "life-saving" and grounded in science. I am willing to bet there had been quite a few kids with mental issues that received lobotomy back then would end up getting "gender affirming" care nowadays. Based on detrans stories online I do not believe these procedures are "voluntary". Coercion seems common. At least that's what had been said in Congress under the oath.
- spondylosaurus 3y ago
  You mean the people testifying before Congress who were later linked to a small Evangelical astroturfing movement seeking to push anti-trans legislation across the country? https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/anti-trans-transgender-health-care-ban-legislation-bill-minors-children-lgbtq/ https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/anti-trans-tran... Including one "detrans" activist who disavowed her former anti-trans stance, describing it as a form of self-harm, and then went on to retransition? https://elisashupe.wordpress.com/2022/03/03/elisa-shupe-setting-the-record-straight-about-james-shupe/ https://elisashupe.wordpress.com/2022/03/03/elisa-shupe-sett... > Radical and gender-critical feminists, conservatives, and faith-based groups would like everyone to believe that gender dysphoria can be cured simply by adopting dangerous beliefs. They want you to think that praying, undergoing conversion therapy, etc., can cure and change you. I can attest that all of their treatments failed to work in my case. Publicly, I sustained during that tenuous time by lying to myself and others that what they said worked. I also shamefully sold their ideologies to the media and the public while overdosing on estrogen supplements in private, trying to desperately lower my testosterone level. My actions resulted in a dangerous blood clot which threatened my health and life. Starting HRT is the single best thing I've ever done for my mental health. You choosing to believe that this is a form of coercion, or mutilation, or lobotomizing stands in direct opposition to established medical practice and countless personal testimonies. (And I should hope you can recognize that modern medical practice is far more advanced than the medicine practiced by Victorian-era bloodletting practioners.) The regret rate for gender-affirmating surgical care is about 1% btw. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8099405/ That's less than the regret rate for hip replacement surgery, which is about 7%. https://arthroplasty.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s42836-019-0007-3 https://arthroplasty.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s428...