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In the areas occupied by russians the killing does not stop when the fighting stops. There are countless examples of this from this war and previous ones. So y

In the areas occupied by russians the killing does not stop when the fighting stops. There are countless examples of this from this war and previous ones. So your claim that borders don’t matter one should just accept conquest is utterly naive. The human wish for fairness has a reason and this comes from a deeper place of understanding that accepting aggression will encourage more aggression.

sneak 3y ago
Well, not accepting aggression is also encouraging more aggression. What is being done now is not working to bring about peace. Something else must be done.
- jnsaff2 3y ago
  Something else is being done, there are sanctions, there is ostracizing, there is building awareness, exposing misinfo, etc. Effectiveness of those stopping russian murder is fairly low however. Ask yourself what would you do if a brute would show up under your home window and start shouting: “you are a nazi, some babtism happened in this neighborhood centuries ago, therefore I demand your home belongs to me”. Then breaks down your front door, occupies your kitchen, kills one of your kids, rapes another, flings stones against your windows every night, cuts your electricity regularly, tries to set the house on fire etc. Would you fight? Would you ask for help? Or would you appreciate a neighbor few streets down telling you ‘all this commotion is ruining my vibe, give your home to the bully and accept them as your new head of family’? Maybe they will not kill you, also maybe they will not starve you in another holodomor? If you have any viable ideas of bringing peace, let’s hear them. If they involve denying agency to the people of Ukraine, telling them that from now on you must live under russian tyranny then this is not a viable solution for ending killing nor bringing lasting peace.
  - sneak 3y ago
    I already made it: a viable idea for bringing about peace is to stop fighting. A war requires at least two combatants. You rejected it, presumably on the basis that it is better to fight a war than to live under Russian occupation. To answer your question directly, I would move somewhere else. This option is legally and practically prohibited by the Ukranian government for half their population.
    - jnsaff2 3y ago
      It is interesting that you lot always call for Ukraine to stop fighting. Why are you not calling for russians to stop fighting or fuck off from Ukraine?
      - sneak 3y ago
        I have not called for Ukraine to stop fighting, as a point of fact.
    - effable 3y ago
      That seems like a horrible suggestion: That might work for one person but an entire country? That people who have lived their lives for generations in Ukraine simply uproot their entire lives, give whatever wealth they've built up and move to a different country where they speak a foreign language, have different cultures and customs, where they need to integrate and learn the language to have a chance at any semblance of a life. Sorry that sounds like a horrible idea.
      - sneak 3y ago
        Well, the alternative is slow suffering and eventual capture and/or death at the hands of a better-resourced adversary. That sounds like a much worse idea. I'd run away, myself. A huge percentage of Ukranian women have already fled the country, mostly to Europe. It's legal for them to do so, but not for the men. Russia has so far been unsuccessful in mass murdering the Ukranians who have fled to Europe, so it seems to be working for them. There is literally zero circumstance that you could put me in that would result in me choosing to fight a war. None.
        jnsaff2 3y ago
        > There is literally zero circumstance that you could put me in that would result in me choosing to fight a war. None. Not even to protect your spouse? Children? Family? Don't try to project your own bravery onto others though. Ukrainians can choose for themselves whether they fight or not. As for the claims that the male population can't leave the country, there are plenty of exceptions when they can and even then they don't need to become soldiers. I have several team mates who work either from Ukraine or abroad and have no issues.

sneak 3y ago

Well, not accepting aggression is also encouraging more aggression. What is being done now is not working to bring about peace. Something else must be done.

jnsaff2 3y ago
Something else is being done, there are sanctions, there is ostracizing, there is building awareness, exposing misinfo, etc. Effectiveness of those stopping russian murder is fairly low however. Ask yourself what would you do if a brute would show up under your home window and start shouting: “you are a nazi, some babtism happened in this neighborhood centuries ago, therefore I demand your home belongs to me”. Then breaks down your front door, occupies your kitchen, kills one of your kids, rapes another, flings stones against your windows every night, cuts your electricity regularly, tries to set the house on fire etc. Would you fight? Would you ask for help? Or would you appreciate a neighbor few streets down telling you ‘all this commotion is ruining my vibe, give your home to the bully and accept them as your new head of family’? Maybe they will not kill you, also maybe they will not starve you in another holodomor? If you have any viable ideas of bringing peace, let’s hear them. If they involve denying agency to the people of Ukraine, telling them that from now on you must live under russian tyranny then this is not a viable solution for ending killing nor bringing lasting peace.
- sneak 3y ago
  I already made it: a viable idea for bringing about peace is to stop fighting. A war requires at least two combatants. You rejected it, presumably on the basis that it is better to fight a war than to live under Russian occupation. To answer your question directly, I would move somewhere else. This option is legally and practically prohibited by the Ukranian government for half their population.
  - jnsaff2 3y ago
    It is interesting that you lot always call for Ukraine to stop fighting. Why are you not calling for russians to stop fighting or fuck off from Ukraine?
    - sneak 3y ago
      I have not called for Ukraine to stop fighting, as a point of fact.
  - effable 3y ago
    That seems like a horrible suggestion: That might work for one person but an entire country? That people who have lived their lives for generations in Ukraine simply uproot their entire lives, give whatever wealth they've built up and move to a different country where they speak a foreign language, have different cultures and customs, where they need to integrate and learn the language to have a chance at any semblance of a life. Sorry that sounds like a horrible idea.
    - sneak 3y ago
      Well, the alternative is slow suffering and eventual capture and/or death at the hands of a better-resourced adversary. That sounds like a much worse idea. I'd run away, myself. A huge percentage of Ukranian women have already fled the country, mostly to Europe. It's legal for them to do so, but not for the men. Russia has so far been unsuccessful in mass murdering the Ukranians who have fled to Europe, so it seems to be working for them. There is literally zero circumstance that you could put me in that would result in me choosing to fight a war. None.
      - jnsaff2 3y ago
        > There is literally zero circumstance that you could put me in that would result in me choosing to fight a war. None. Not even to protect your spouse? Children? Family? Don't try to project your own bravery onto others though. Ukrainians can choose for themselves whether they fight or not. As for the claims that the male population can't leave the country, there are plenty of exceptions when they can and even then they don't need to become soldiers. I have several team mates who work either from Ukraine or abroad and have no issues.