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went down this rabbit hole recently and ended up getting a folding ebike once you start scaling up 2 wheel scooter wheels to become big enough to comfortably r

went down this rabbit hole recently and ended up getting a folding ebike once you start scaling up 2 wheel scooter wheels to become big enough to comfortably ride anywhere in a city that wasnt explicitly designed for scooter traffic (nyc for example), the weight of the whole scooter starts surpassing even lighter ebikes (60 lb+), without the benefit of lower costs or more transportability (few/none 500W+ scooters can be carried comfortably through a narrower nyc restaurant door) this one came closest https://inokim.shop/collections/inokim-scooters/products/inokim-ox https://inokim.shop/collections/inokim-scooters/products/ino... but after testing it out I couldn't see the upside over a smaller folding ebike

senkora 3y ago
Any models of folding ebikes that you liked? I’m in the market for one.
- sleepybrett 3y ago
  I have one but it's quite heavy and designed more around cargo, trips to the grocery store etc. I have used to it commute into town to go to the office a few times and it works ok for it, but if I started doing that every day I'd probably buy something more 'commutery'. I have a rad power bikes 'expand 5'.
  - masklinn 3y ago
    What is the commutery-ness issue? The tyres do look chonky which might be inefficient for long-ish distance, or is it a bit small for long rides? Or is the maintenance a bit much for a daily?
    - sleepybrett 3y ago
      Yeah it's got wide tires (and they are pretty small in diameter as well) and it's a stepthrough with an awfully heavy frame. I might go with something like the radcity if I were going to commute daily. Currently that commute is only 6ish miles though and I'm still mostly WFH, so it's not as critical. Rad does consider it a commuter bike, I just consider it a tad non-optimal but not anything terrible. Great for neighborhood errands though. My neighborhood 'main drag' is great for a little shopping/eating but is about a mile and change away so it's certainly walkable but I wouldn't want to lug groceries a mile up a hill so the bike is perfect. Haven't touched my car all summer unless I was getting out of the city. It is a bit small. I think they rate it for people who are 5'10" max, which is my height to get full leg extension. While it does fold it is quite heavy so if you are thinking about a scenario where you drive the edge of the city and bike the rest of the way in just know that getting it in and out of a trunk is a bit of a wrestling match. Maintenance-wise, no big complaints in almost a year and a half. I had a flat tire and was able to find a replacement tube no problem at a local bike shop. I've had to replace the brake pads and frayed up the brake cable in the process so I replaced that too, did all the work myself cost me maybe ~$20 in parts. Considering swapping the brakes for some 'hybrid hydraulic brakes' aka cable pull hydraulics, those will run me a couple hundred bucks for the pair, the work seems easy enough if you've ever swung a wrench. Did some lubing of the chain... No battery issues, no controller issues. https://www.radpowerbikes.com/collections/electric-city-commuter-bikes/products/radexpand-electric-folding-bike?variant=39442977783904 https://www.radpowerbikes.com/collections/electric-city-comm...
- scrose 3y ago
  I have a 2017 Evelo Quest One that’s wrapping up it’s 6th year now. It’s been almost entirely hassle free besides general maintenance and a battery replacement after ~4 years. It looks like the company replaced it with the Evelo Dash. There’s lots of good folding electric options right now, but if your budget allows for it, I’d *highly* recommend looking for folders with Gates drives. You will be able to roll and hold the bike folded between your legs without worrying about wiping grease all over your pants(or some unfortunate soul who bumps into it). It’s also one of the few things that lives up to its hype — it’s been entirely maintenance-free over the last ~6years I’ve been riding
  - phkahler 3y ago
    >> I’d highly recommend looking for folders with Gates drives. Back in '07 I was working in automotive electric steering systems and the design called for a belt between motor and ball-nut. I was shocked the safety analysis was OK with that, but the durability and test data said it would be fine. We used Gates belts. I've never heard of any problem with those systems which are 15 years old now. Apparently their belts are of top notch reliability.
  - jareklupinski 3y ago
    the "evelo dash" is like the audi to the VW "hitway bk10m" i ended up getting
- mperham 3y ago
  Brompton is the king of portable folders. The Lectric 3.0 is the king of utility folders.
- jareklupinski 3y ago
  i ended up going with the cheapest one that can still carry me around far enough (both ways) comfortably: https://www.amazon.com/HITWAY-Electric-Removable-20-55mile-BK10M/dp/B0C8SDYNN7 https://www.amazon.com/HITWAY-Electric-Removable-20-55mile-B... (it was 800 when i purchased, also available under a number of different brand names if you search for things like 'foldable 20 inch fat tire ebike') every brand's advantages just started blurring together until someone said "it's just going to be stolen anyway..." with the money i saved by getting a cheaper bike, i bought the most expensive lock, to keep the thing from riding away :)
smarmgoblin 3y ago
That’s correct. I have the smallest offering from the manufacturer you linked and it’s super portable (30lbs) but the ride is bumpy even on relatively smooth road. You do get used to it but never feels quite as safe as a bike.
jessriedel 3y ago
Any thoughts on the mechanics behind this? For any wheel size and range, a scooter naively seems like it is going to have strictly less metal than an e-bike, so I would have thought they would be lighter.
- pkage 3y ago
  You don't pedal on an scooter, so the battery needs to be big enough to carry around both you and the larger battery (adding weight). Conversely, e-bikes can assist your pedaling (rather than having to replace it in all cases) so they can be lighter.
- rightbyte 3y ago
  A scooter is a flat plate with a steering column adding no strength. A bicycle is two triangle elements of pipes.
- HPsquared 3y ago
  The frame of a bicycle is probably a lot lighter, as a sort of triangulated truss - compared to the "solid beam" style of a scooter. Disadvantage is it takes more space.
- bee_rider 3y ago
  I wonder why nobody has done electric rollerblades yet.
  - williamscales 3y ago
    People have: https://youtu.be/yttvsEFBUb8 https://youtu.be/yttvsEFBUb8
  - sleepybrett 3y ago
    ... they have https://www.escendblades.com/ https://www.escendblades.com/
  - btbuildem 3y ago
    A quick web search will dispel this assumption -- there are a number of products out there fitting that description.
Pxtl 3y ago
Isn't range a big factor here? Like, the shortest-ranged brand-name electric kickscooters have a range of like 15 miles, while that's the most you can get out the longest-ranged onewheels. It seems like it'd be possible to offer ultralight kickscooters that would be an apples-to-apples comparison with the onewheel that could fold down to the same collapsed size.
- jareklupinski 3y ago
  there was a much larger variety of these exact kinds during the pandemic, but trying to find one these days is hard, and the used ones have company names that no longer exist the smaller and lighter they are, the more integrated and specialized parts they have, for which replacements need to come directly from the manufacturer :( still kind of crazy, the sheer variety of models that are still on youtube videos from just a couple years ago, that are no longer even possible...

senkora 3y ago

Any models of folding ebikes that you liked? I’m in the market for one.

sleepybrett 3y ago
I have one but it's quite heavy and designed more around cargo, trips to the grocery store etc. I have used to it commute into town to go to the office a few times and it works ok for it, but if I started doing that every day I'd probably buy something more 'commutery'. I have a rad power bikes 'expand 5'.
- masklinn 3y ago
  What is the commutery-ness issue? The tyres do look chonky which might be inefficient for long-ish distance, or is it a bit small for long rides? Or is the maintenance a bit much for a daily?
  - sleepybrett 3y ago
    Yeah it's got wide tires (and they are pretty small in diameter as well) and it's a stepthrough with an awfully heavy frame. I might go with something like the radcity if I were going to commute daily. Currently that commute is only 6ish miles though and I'm still mostly WFH, so it's not as critical. Rad does consider it a commuter bike, I just consider it a tad non-optimal but not anything terrible. Great for neighborhood errands though. My neighborhood 'main drag' is great for a little shopping/eating but is about a mile and change away so it's certainly walkable but I wouldn't want to lug groceries a mile up a hill so the bike is perfect. Haven't touched my car all summer unless I was getting out of the city. It is a bit small. I think they rate it for people who are 5'10" max, which is my height to get full leg extension. While it does fold it is quite heavy so if you are thinking about a scenario where you drive the edge of the city and bike the rest of the way in just know that getting it in and out of a trunk is a bit of a wrestling match. Maintenance-wise, no big complaints in almost a year and a half. I had a flat tire and was able to find a replacement tube no problem at a local bike shop. I've had to replace the brake pads and frayed up the brake cable in the process so I replaced that too, did all the work myself cost me maybe ~$20 in parts. Considering swapping the brakes for some 'hybrid hydraulic brakes' aka cable pull hydraulics, those will run me a couple hundred bucks for the pair, the work seems easy enough if you've ever swung a wrench. Did some lubing of the chain... No battery issues, no controller issues. https://www.radpowerbikes.com/collections/electric-city-commuter-bikes/products/radexpand-electric-folding-bike?variant=39442977783904 https://www.radpowerbikes.com/collections/electric-city-comm...
scrose 3y ago
I have a 2017 Evelo Quest One that’s wrapping up it’s 6th year now. It’s been almost entirely hassle free besides general maintenance and a battery replacement after ~4 years. It looks like the company replaced it with the Evelo Dash. There’s lots of good folding electric options right now, but if your budget allows for it, I’d *highly* recommend looking for folders with Gates drives. You will be able to roll and hold the bike folded between your legs without worrying about wiping grease all over your pants(or some unfortunate soul who bumps into it). It’s also one of the few things that lives up to its hype — it’s been entirely maintenance-free over the last ~6years I’ve been riding
- phkahler 3y ago
  >> I’d highly recommend looking for folders with Gates drives. Back in '07 I was working in automotive electric steering systems and the design called for a belt between motor and ball-nut. I was shocked the safety analysis was OK with that, but the durability and test data said it would be fine. We used Gates belts. I've never heard of any problem with those systems which are 15 years old now. Apparently their belts are of top notch reliability.
- jareklupinski 3y ago
  the "evelo dash" is like the audi to the VW "hitway bk10m" i ended up getting
mperham 3y ago
Brompton is the king of portable folders. The Lectric 3.0 is the king of utility folders.
jareklupinski 3y ago
i ended up going with the cheapest one that can still carry me around far enough (both ways) comfortably: https://www.amazon.com/HITWAY-Electric-Removable-20-55mile-BK10M/dp/B0C8SDYNN7 https://www.amazon.com/HITWAY-Electric-Removable-20-55mile-B... (it was 800 when i purchased, also available under a number of different brand names if you search for things like 'foldable 20 inch fat tire ebike') every brand's advantages just started blurring together until someone said "it's just going to be stolen anyway..." with the money i saved by getting a cheaper bike, i bought the most expensive lock, to keep the thing from riding away :)

smarmgoblin 3y ago

That’s correct. I have the smallest offering from the manufacturer you linked and it’s super portable (30lbs) but the ride is bumpy even on relatively smooth road. You do get used to it but never feels quite as safe as a bike.

jessriedel 3y ago

Any thoughts on the mechanics behind this? For any wheel size and range, a scooter naively seems like it is going to have strictly less metal than an e-bike, so I would have thought they would be lighter.

pkage 3y ago
You don't pedal on an scooter, so the battery needs to be big enough to carry around both you and the larger battery (adding weight). Conversely, e-bikes can assist your pedaling (rather than having to replace it in all cases) so they can be lighter.
rightbyte 3y ago
A scooter is a flat plate with a steering column adding no strength. A bicycle is two triangle elements of pipes.
HPsquared 3y ago
The frame of a bicycle is probably a lot lighter, as a sort of triangulated truss - compared to the "solid beam" style of a scooter. Disadvantage is it takes more space.
bee_rider 3y ago
I wonder why nobody has done electric rollerblades yet.
- williamscales 3y ago
  People have: https://youtu.be/yttvsEFBUb8 https://youtu.be/yttvsEFBUb8
- sleepybrett 3y ago
  ... they have https://www.escendblades.com/ https://www.escendblades.com/
- btbuildem 3y ago
  A quick web search will dispel this assumption -- there are a number of products out there fitting that description.

Pxtl 3y ago

Isn't range a big factor here? Like, the shortest-ranged brand-name electric kickscooters have a range of like 15 miles, while that's the most you can get out the longest-ranged onewheels. It seems like it'd be possible to offer ultralight kickscooters that would be an apples-to-apples comparison with the onewheel that could fold down to the same collapsed size.

jareklupinski 3y ago
there was a much larger variety of these exact kinds during the pandemic, but trying to find one these days is hard, and the used ones have company names that no longer exist the smaller and lighter they are, the more integrated and specialized parts they have, for which replacements need to come directly from the manufacturer :( still kind of crazy, the sheer variety of models that are still on youtube videos from just a couple years ago, that are no longer even possible...