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As a black person, the switch from master to main, is the most condescendingly racist thing that has been widely adopted in tech. It says "black people are too

As a black person, the switch from master to main, is the most condescendingly racist thing that has been widely adopted in tech. It says "black people are too stupid to understand context. We (small group of white people) must protect them against words." Another thing it does, is that it promotes the identification of blacks as slaves when all races have been enslaved (and continue to this day).

sleiben 3y ago
100% with you here! Great arguments edit: It also reminds me of men playing feminist and stepping (aggressively) up to protect women’s rights. I heard from my female colleagues that they hate this since it implies that women are like children and aren’t able or mature enough to speak up for themselves. So the «strong men» need now to protect them…
- SSLy 3y ago
  I don't live in USA, but this very week one of such staunch feminists was ousted as a groomer and violent partner. https://www.wirtualnemedia.pl/artykul/gargamel-jakub-chuptys-przemoc-byla-dziewczyna https://www.wirtualnemedia.pl/artykul/gargamel-jakub-chuptys...
  - gadders 3y ago
    Many such cases.
PartiallyTyped 3y ago
The “white saviour” complex is well documented. Well-meaning but racist in their ignorance white people try to save people based on racist stereotypes and caricatures of imagined problems.
about3fitty 3y ago
I would like to ask: do you have a position on the following? - an allowlist/blocklist to replace whitelist/blacklist -primary/replica to replace master/slave Also, how old are you? I’m not young but not old and I don’t associate racial overtones to the latter terms
- tapland 3y ago
  Is replica used that way? That can't be
- dangus 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - OscarDC 3y ago
    I agree with the most part of what you wrote and I don't want to turn this even more into an unconstructive flame war than it already is. I just wanted to reply on the following point: > I knew HN had a bunch of conservative and libertarian tech bros but…holy shit. This whole thread is unhinged. Many people on that thread seem to not be american so thinking of them through a US political lens may not be pertinent - the politically-loaded, US-centric, source of the change may also be the source of the frustration with it in the first place (see the bottom of this reply). Just on this point, I consider myself left-leaning (and from what I can see, US democrats would mostly be at the center - and Biden center-right - of the political spectrum in my country), yet I share the point of view of the other commenters regarding the "master" change and the ways it is pushed. > In what universe is master/slave not racist For the "master" part at least, I would say most people do not link it to slavery because most people are not from an english-speaking country. For me, when I read master I may just think about master recordings. That does not mean that it may or may not have a racism-linked origin (I have no idea about that) but understand that many people around the world don't do the connection. Then, as it is mostly US people that push for other to change that name vehemently, this make many people think that those are americans that want to push their current political ideology down someone else's throat (which has a completely different cultural and political background) and may elicit a strong response.
    - dangus 3y ago
      I’m speaking purely from the context of the US, and I wouldn’t want to shove our terminology down anyone else’s throat. That said, the US does drive a lot of software culture since it’s the industry epicenter, so I guess it’s unavoidable at some point. Maybe I could have used less politically-charged language, but in my eyes it was necessary to surface the connection. I think that in the US, a very specific political group rallies around opposition to social justice, and that group has a tendency to try and hide their underlying motivations (e.g., using dogwhistling).
jalapenos 3y ago
Based on how uppity about it around the time the whites I talked to about it were, yes it was 100% this. The high horse riding was surreal. They all took long savouring draws of their own farts after each 'master' branch they renamed to 'main'. When I mentioned that none of the people they did this in the name of were helped, they met it with abject hostility. Narcissism is a hell of a condition.
philistine 3y ago
Hey, maybe the white dude feels icky about the master/slave thing. Maybe it's not about the opinions of black people but words we want in common usage in our societies.
- TheHappyOddish 3y ago
  Is the intent to completely remove the terms? That's a new angle I hadn't heard. I guess it makes said guilty feeling persons life easier, as they can't hear about the currently happening slavery in the world and can continue on their merry way.
  - philistine 3y ago
    The point is to correlate the word slavery with the concept of human slavery only. Disallowing a word to be used outside that usage is better for everyone.
worik 3y ago
I've started using "mistress" Meh

sleiben 3y ago

100% with you here! Great arguments edit: It also reminds me of men playing feminist and stepping (aggressively) up to protect women’s rights. I heard from my female colleagues that they hate this since it implies that women are like children and aren’t able or mature enough to speak up for themselves. So the «strong men» need now to protect them…

SSLy 3y ago
I don't live in USA, but this very week one of such staunch feminists was ousted as a groomer and violent partner. https://www.wirtualnemedia.pl/artykul/gargamel-jakub-chuptys-przemoc-byla-dziewczyna https://www.wirtualnemedia.pl/artykul/gargamel-jakub-chuptys...
- gadders 3y ago
  Many such cases.

PartiallyTyped 3y ago

The “white saviour” complex is well documented. Well-meaning but racist in their ignorance white people try to save people based on racist stereotypes and caricatures of imagined problems.

about3fitty 3y ago

I would like to ask: do you have a position on the following? - an allowlist/blocklist to replace whitelist/blacklist -primary/replica to replace master/slave Also, how old are you? I’m not young but not old and I don’t associate racial overtones to the latter terms

tapland 3y ago
Is replica used that way? That can't be
dangus 3y ago
[flagged]
- OscarDC 3y ago
  I agree with the most part of what you wrote and I don't want to turn this even more into an unconstructive flame war than it already is. I just wanted to reply on the following point: > I knew HN had a bunch of conservative and libertarian tech bros but…holy shit. This whole thread is unhinged. Many people on that thread seem to not be american so thinking of them through a US political lens may not be pertinent - the politically-loaded, US-centric, source of the change may also be the source of the frustration with it in the first place (see the bottom of this reply). Just on this point, I consider myself left-leaning (and from what I can see, US democrats would mostly be at the center - and Biden center-right - of the political spectrum in my country), yet I share the point of view of the other commenters regarding the "master" change and the ways it is pushed. > In what universe is master/slave not racist For the "master" part at least, I would say most people do not link it to slavery because most people are not from an english-speaking country. For me, when I read master I may just think about master recordings. That does not mean that it may or may not have a racism-linked origin (I have no idea about that) but understand that many people around the world don't do the connection. Then, as it is mostly US people that push for other to change that name vehemently, this make many people think that those are americans that want to push their current political ideology down someone else's throat (which has a completely different cultural and political background) and may elicit a strong response.
  - dangus 3y ago
    I’m speaking purely from the context of the US, and I wouldn’t want to shove our terminology down anyone else’s throat. That said, the US does drive a lot of software culture since it’s the industry epicenter, so I guess it’s unavoidable at some point. Maybe I could have used less politically-charged language, but in my eyes it was necessary to surface the connection. I think that in the US, a very specific political group rallies around opposition to social justice, and that group has a tendency to try and hide their underlying motivations (e.g., using dogwhistling).

jalapenos 3y ago

Based on how uppity about it around the time the whites I talked to about it were, yes it was 100% this. The high horse riding was surreal. They all took long savouring draws of their own farts after each 'master' branch they renamed to 'main'. When I mentioned that none of the people they did this in the name of were helped, they met it with abject hostility. Narcissism is a hell of a condition.

philistine 3y ago

Hey, maybe the white dude feels icky about the master/slave thing. Maybe it's not about the opinions of black people but words we want in common usage in our societies.

TheHappyOddish 3y ago
Is the intent to completely remove the terms? That's a new angle I hadn't heard. I guess it makes said guilty feeling persons life easier, as they can't hear about the currently happening slavery in the world and can continue on their merry way.
- philistine 3y ago
  The point is to correlate the word slavery with the concept of human slavery only. Disallowing a word to be used outside that usage is better for everyone.

worik 3y ago

I've started using "mistress" Meh