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Do you really want to be "average" at your job? What do you really want to do? I've worked with barely average developers and believe me, they frustrate the re

Do you really want to be "average" at your job? What do you really want to do? I've worked with barely average developers and believe me, they frustrate the rest of the team. They'll copy-and-paste the same code 5x instead of asking where they should put a new module. They'll commit untested code into main, and leave it to the next guy to clean it up, just so they can close their ticket. Communication is often poor. We all don't know things. The problem with "average" is they don't ask questions.

throwaway1183 3y ago
Yeah, totally. At least I would try to communicate on important decisions. However, I have zero interest in making decisions, making presentation, trying to prove things or any of that. All I want is a task that is achievable in given allocated time and fits my skill level. I have given up on hopes of learning. There is no such thing as learning after highschool. It's always one thing after another. College is chasing grades. Post graduate chasing papers. Never got a true chance to dive and learn. There is no room for failure. All I had to do was put of patch work to clear the subjects. How can I expect myself to be good when I have cheated the system throughout my life. Hence, if I get the chance, I would love to be average. No responsibility. Slightly better pay. I feel I can study what interest me just to crush my own ego. Hope it makes sense.
- icedchai 3y ago
  It sounds like you just want to get paid and go home. I'm not going to judge, but I think you need to focus on specific industries, not job titles. All the roles you list can be quite demanding. Look for a non-tech, older company where they are set in their ways and have to deal with a ton of regulations. Think banks, insurance, defense, government.
  - throwaway1183 3y ago
    Oh!! Thank you!! These are the answers I am looking for because these never crossed my thoughts. These are boring and no one likes them! Exactly my taste.
    - icedchai 3y ago
      Good luck! Also, consider a tech adjacent role like "scrum master." I once worked with a scrum master who did an hour of work a day if he was lucky. I mean, he did eventually get laid off... but...
- Exuma 3y ago
  Talk about a loser mentality. Stay far away from my companies … barf
  - throwaway1183 3y ago
    wow, what is wrong with being average and trying to enjoy life? I am pretty sure you have zero contribution to llvm, pytorch, react, vue, js, c, python, linux, or heck even the device you are typing. You also fall on same average category. If you had any idea, you would have written something about it. The talent at top are polite enough to see the difference. Your arrogance reminds me of some egoist friend.
    - jstx1 3y ago
      This isn't average: > I have given up on hopes of learning. There is no such thing as learning after highschool. This is refusing to learn at an industry where continually learning is one of the most important things you need to do. You're actively choosing to be bad at your job.
      - throwaway1183 3y ago
        I don't know how to argue on that. Learning is a slow process that takes time and effort. The results aren't visible immediately. Meanwhile industry wants to get the job done and be over with it. We are hired to work. I don't want to go home and learn more about the things so that I can do the job better. There is literally no incentive in doing it better than just doing it alright. I would rather learn things from diverse topics and interests that will benefit that I can enjoy in the long run.
        icedchai 3y ago
        Learning is part of the job. Finding information on technical topics is soooo much easier today than it was 20 or 30 years ago! Watch youtube, download an ebook, look at somebody's blog. When I as a young teenager, learning about programming in the early 90's, I had to convince my parents to order physical books that would take weeks to arrive.
badpun 3y ago
That's not average, that's bottom of the barrel. Average developers do a decent enough job, but aren't super fast about it. They also can't conceive of large refactorings in their head, don't follow all the latest trends in their area of expertise etc. They're just average. Majority of working developers are like that, by definition.
- throwaway1183 3y ago
  It seems like both of us have similar definition of an average. That's really cool that you got my idea of being average. Thank you! So do you have any clue how I can optimize the position in the industry? I am interested in the most of the subtopics in the field of computer science. I just want to find a route with highest reward for an average developer. Apparently average research engineers makes a lot compared to say web developer, but the route requires PhD. What do you think is a good track?
  - badpun 3y ago
    Those "average" PhD researchers are in reality all very smart and hard working people. If you want big salaries, people who get them often have PhD degree from top20 universities in the world. They will be your competition when interviewing. In general, if you want to maximize money, it does not make sense to go into any hard and niche fields (graphics, machine learning research etc.) because they're filled with very talented enthusiasts, and if you're not that, you will have a very hard time even being average in such fields. Not to mention that such fields often (but not always) pay less that your run of the mill backend development job, and have 1000x less open positions, which means it's harder to apply for jobs, you may have to move more often etc. It's basically all downsides pretty much, and the only upside is being able to work on your passion - which is what motivates people who get into those fields.
    - throwaway1183 3y ago
      > It's basically all downsides pretty much, and the only upside is being able to work on your passion - which is what motivates people who get into those fields. Yes!! I can totally relate to what you are saying. I got started because I was interested and I am still passionate about it. But there is only so much that I can do. It just doesn't make sense for me to continue for PhD because even with PhD there is no guarantee that I would be able to get somewhere as I am definitely not someone coming from those top20 universities. So by definition I rule out the chances of being an average research engineer. That's one clarity! Thank you! Since I have most background in hard niches as you mentioned above, is there a way to transition to something else? What would the possible path be like if my ultimate goal is to become staff engineer or principal engineer?

throwaway1183 3y ago

Yeah, totally. At least I would try to communicate on important decisions. However, I have zero interest in making decisions, making presentation, trying to prove things or any of that. All I want is a task that is achievable in given allocated time and fits my skill level. I have given up on hopes of learning. There is no such thing as learning after highschool. It's always one thing after another. College is chasing grades. Post graduate chasing papers. Never got a true chance to dive and learn. There is no room for failure. All I had to do was put of patch work to clear the subjects. How can I expect myself to be good when I have cheated the system throughout my life. Hence, if I get the chance, I would love to be average. No responsibility. Slightly better pay. I feel I can study what interest me just to crush my own ego. Hope it makes sense.

icedchai 3y ago
It sounds like you just want to get paid and go home. I'm not going to judge, but I think you need to focus on specific industries, not job titles. All the roles you list can be quite demanding. Look for a non-tech, older company where they are set in their ways and have to deal with a ton of regulations. Think banks, insurance, defense, government.
- throwaway1183 3y ago
  Oh!! Thank you!! These are the answers I am looking for because these never crossed my thoughts. These are boring and no one likes them! Exactly my taste.
  - icedchai 3y ago
    Good luck! Also, consider a tech adjacent role like "scrum master." I once worked with a scrum master who did an hour of work a day if he was lucky. I mean, he did eventually get laid off... but...
Exuma 3y ago
Talk about a loser mentality. Stay far away from my companies … barf
- throwaway1183 3y ago
  wow, what is wrong with being average and trying to enjoy life? I am pretty sure you have zero contribution to llvm, pytorch, react, vue, js, c, python, linux, or heck even the device you are typing. You also fall on same average category. If you had any idea, you would have written something about it. The talent at top are polite enough to see the difference. Your arrogance reminds me of some egoist friend.
  - jstx1 3y ago
    This isn't average: > I have given up on hopes of learning. There is no such thing as learning after highschool. This is refusing to learn at an industry where continually learning is one of the most important things you need to do. You're actively choosing to be bad at your job.
    - throwaway1183 3y ago
      I don't know how to argue on that. Learning is a slow process that takes time and effort. The results aren't visible immediately. Meanwhile industry wants to get the job done and be over with it. We are hired to work. I don't want to go home and learn more about the things so that I can do the job better. There is literally no incentive in doing it better than just doing it alright. I would rather learn things from diverse topics and interests that will benefit that I can enjoy in the long run.
      - icedchai 3y ago
        Learning is part of the job. Finding information on technical topics is soooo much easier today than it was 20 or 30 years ago! Watch youtube, download an ebook, look at somebody's blog. When I as a young teenager, learning about programming in the early 90's, I had to convince my parents to order physical books that would take weeks to arrive.

badpun 3y ago

That's not average, that's bottom of the barrel. Average developers do a decent enough job, but aren't super fast about it. They also can't conceive of large refactorings in their head, don't follow all the latest trends in their area of expertise etc. They're just average. Majority of working developers are like that, by definition.

throwaway1183 3y ago
It seems like both of us have similar definition of an average. That's really cool that you got my idea of being average. Thank you! So do you have any clue how I can optimize the position in the industry? I am interested in the most of the subtopics in the field of computer science. I just want to find a route with highest reward for an average developer. Apparently average research engineers makes a lot compared to say web developer, but the route requires PhD. What do you think is a good track?
- badpun 3y ago
  Those "average" PhD researchers are in reality all very smart and hard working people. If you want big salaries, people who get them often have PhD degree from top20 universities in the world. They will be your competition when interviewing. In general, if you want to maximize money, it does not make sense to go into any hard and niche fields (graphics, machine learning research etc.) because they're filled with very talented enthusiasts, and if you're not that, you will have a very hard time even being average in such fields. Not to mention that such fields often (but not always) pay less that your run of the mill backend development job, and have 1000x less open positions, which means it's harder to apply for jobs, you may have to move more often etc. It's basically all downsides pretty much, and the only upside is being able to work on your passion - which is what motivates people who get into those fields.
  - throwaway1183 3y ago
    > It's basically all downsides pretty much, and the only upside is being able to work on your passion - which is what motivates people who get into those fields. Yes!! I can totally relate to what you are saying. I got started because I was interested and I am still passionate about it. But there is only so much that I can do. It just doesn't make sense for me to continue for PhD because even with PhD there is no guarantee that I would be able to get somewhere as I am definitely not someone coming from those top20 universities. So by definition I rule out the chances of being an average research engineer. That's one clarity! Thank you! Since I have most background in hard niches as you mentioned above, is there a way to transition to something else? What would the possible path be like if my ultimate goal is to become staff engineer or principal engineer?