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So the parents, attorneys, used their child's unfortunate accidental death to sue anyone they could - including their daughter's friend's family. This won't br

So the parents, attorneys, used their child's unfortunate accidental death to sue anyone they could - including their daughter's friend's family. This won't bring their daughter back, and it probably won't result in any improvement that would prevent a similar crash. It's just extortion because they can. And it probably will leave an even bigger emotional scar on the other girl who lived. The fact that this was an e-bike is irrelevant, aside from perhaps the extra weight. It's difficult to imagine the kid was using the electric features of the bike while going down that steep hill, because you could probably coast on any bike faster than 25mph on a hill like that. Plenty of non-electric bikes could have a brake failure, assuming that was the case in this situation. And riders can misjudge their bike's handling/braking capabilities with the extra weight of a passenger. None of these things are intentional or justify lawsuits. Perhaps the state should sue the parents for not helicoptering and ensuring that two kids didn't ride one bike down a steep hill. After all, if every other player involved is liable, then the parents should also be liable. Or nobody is liable because it was an unfortunate accident.

analog31 3y ago
I realize this is a quibble, but two people riding down a steep hill on a single bike would have been a really rare -- if not practically impossible -- occurrence before the advent of e-bikes. Very few conventional bikes were ever sold with capacity for a second rider, and getting to the point of trying that stunt would have involved more endurance than most kids are likely to possess. On the other hand, many of the the newer motorcycle-style e-bikes are being designed, marketed, and sold, as two-seaters. One of the rules for the "progressive drivers license" in my state, for teenagers, is that they can't have more than one teenager in the car at a time.
- hotpotamus 3y ago
  Back in the old days you could easily fit two on a banana seat. Or if you wanted to up the danger a bit, your friend could sit on the handlebars.
- taeric 3y ago
  May be uncommon, but so are deaths from bicycle falls. Doesn't make them not exist. I know we would file friends on bikes going down hills from time to time. Usually stopped when we got hurt.
- michaelteter 3y ago
  I would argue that pair riding down a hill on a bike would be very common for kids, regardless of whether they would be able to ride back up together or not. Firstly, it's fun and a bit crazy/wild. And the return trip back up might just be two kids walking and pushing one bike. After all, a non-e-bike would get used exactly like this by kids. Really, giving a kid any kind of moving vehicle means new risks. Even if everything is right, crashes happen. I seriously doubt the one girl bought her e-bike with the strong consideration of it being a "two person bike". Besides, there are plenty of teens or adults who might weigh the same as those two girls together. The second seat is irrelevant.
  - analog31 3y ago
    That's fair. Maybe I've air-brushed my childhood experiences. Also, we didn't have any hills. Here's one of the latest Trek ebikes. Roughly half of the marketing pictures show two riders. Naturally, the e-bike market is changing rapidly, and whatever I say could be wrong next week. https://electra.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/electra-bikes/electra-e-bikes/recreation-e-bikes/ponto-go/ponto-go/p/41206/ https://electra.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/electra-bikes/e...
- sbierwagen 3y ago
  >but two people riding down a steep hill on a single bike would have been a really rare -- if not practically impossible -- occurrence before the advent of e-bikes Really? Ten seconds on google: https://www.vintag.es/2015/11/lovely-vintage-photos-of-couple-of-kids.html https://www.vintag.es/2015/11/lovely-vintage-photos-of-coupl...
xp84 3y ago
This is a bad take, because the parents are already obviously wealthy. The money will mean nothing to them. They want to force companies like Rad to change, and nothing forces that besides government force (Lol, at this point) or money. In this case, they want them to not spec bikes with flimsy components like the pathetic brakes described by a half-dozen people in that article as needing constant adjustment, with the consequences of forgetting to do it every couple weeks that you might die. I certainly won't buy an e-bike with those kind of brakes myself now, and the fact that no sane person who knows the risk would, really does suggest that perhaps selling such a bike now that we've seen the risks, is very irresponsible. I hope they get a huge settlement or judgment that makes all e-bike makers reconsider the position on the spectrum of cheap vs. safe that they have chosen.
- taeric 3y ago
  There is no evidence that the spec of the bike factored into, though? And if they just wanted to send a message to the bike company, why sue the other girl? Really, that last point really hits me poorly.
- michaelteter 3y ago
  If you watch many bike shows on youtube, you'll see that a lot of storebought bikes have woefully lacking brakes and usually need proper adjustment frequently to keep them working as good as they possibly can. And even well designed bikes can have failures when used outside of their expected scenarios (broken seatposts, handlebars). Most bike owners don't even think about bike maintenance unless something obvious is broken. Heck, car parking brakes can fail on hills, so drivers need to know to turn their front wheels the right way to help prevent a runaway car. Many car parking brakes aren't designed for steep hills. Is the car maker at fault if the parking brake fails in an abnormal environment? Some bikes with caliper brakes can have tire failures due to rim heating from long downhill braking. And a blown front tire could lead to a bad crash. Are the bike makers, wheel makers, brake makers, and tire makers at fault here too? Or perhaps California should be sued for making a road that's too steep? As for rich people not suing because they need more money... these people sued their daughter's friend's family. How is that going to help? All that will do is add salt to the wound the living child probably has. In fact, it's just evil to do that to the other kid.
briHass 3y ago
As horrible as it is to imagine losing a child, what I can't imagine is ever suing private individuals, neighbors, over what is clearly an accident. The other girl was only superficially harmed from the crash, so it's likely their daughter's death was one of those freak cases: hit her head just right even though she had a helmet on. Most active kids probably engage in activities that have a non-zero chance of death or serious injury on a regular basis. 99.999% of the time, if injuries result, they are minor, but there's always going to be a few instances where the outcome is horrific. Society is worse because of the lawsuit (and fear of lawsuit) culture this type of behavior results in.
- tnecniv 3y ago
  Every few years you hear about a kid dying playing baseball (the last major league death was almost a century ago despite the ball flying around a lot faster and hundreds of thousands of games are played by people of all ages every year). It’s certainly awful, but imagine suing the league over a freak comeback hit.

analog31 3y ago

I realize this is a quibble, but two people riding down a steep hill on a single bike would have been a really rare -- if not practically impossible -- occurrence before the advent of e-bikes. Very few conventional bikes were ever sold with capacity for a second rider, and getting to the point of trying that stunt would have involved more endurance than most kids are likely to possess. On the other hand, many of the the newer motorcycle-style e-bikes are being designed, marketed, and sold, as two-seaters. One of the rules for the "progressive drivers license" in my state, for teenagers, is that they can't have more than one teenager in the car at a time.

hotpotamus 3y ago
Back in the old days you could easily fit two on a banana seat. Or if you wanted to up the danger a bit, your friend could sit on the handlebars.
taeric 3y ago
May be uncommon, but so are deaths from bicycle falls. Doesn't make them not exist. I know we would file friends on bikes going down hills from time to time. Usually stopped when we got hurt.
michaelteter 3y ago
I would argue that pair riding down a hill on a bike would be very common for kids, regardless of whether they would be able to ride back up together or not. Firstly, it's fun and a bit crazy/wild. And the return trip back up might just be two kids walking and pushing one bike. After all, a non-e-bike would get used exactly like this by kids. Really, giving a kid any kind of moving vehicle means new risks. Even if everything is right, crashes happen. I seriously doubt the one girl bought her e-bike with the strong consideration of it being a "two person bike". Besides, there are plenty of teens or adults who might weigh the same as those two girls together. The second seat is irrelevant.
- analog31 3y ago
  That's fair. Maybe I've air-brushed my childhood experiences. Also, we didn't have any hills. Here's one of the latest Trek ebikes. Roughly half of the marketing pictures show two riders. Naturally, the e-bike market is changing rapidly, and whatever I say could be wrong next week. https://electra.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/electra-bikes/electra-e-bikes/recreation-e-bikes/ponto-go/ponto-go/p/41206/ https://electra.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/electra-bikes/e...
sbierwagen 3y ago
>but two people riding down a steep hill on a single bike would have been a really rare -- if not practically impossible -- occurrence before the advent of e-bikes Really? Ten seconds on google: https://www.vintag.es/2015/11/lovely-vintage-photos-of-couple-of-kids.html https://www.vintag.es/2015/11/lovely-vintage-photos-of-coupl...

xp84 3y ago

This is a bad take, because the parents are already obviously wealthy. The money will mean nothing to them. They want to force companies like Rad to change, and nothing forces that besides government force (Lol, at this point) or money. In this case, they want them to not spec bikes with flimsy components like the pathetic brakes described by a half-dozen people in that article as needing constant adjustment, with the consequences of forgetting to do it every couple weeks that you might die. I certainly won't buy an e-bike with those kind of brakes myself now, and the fact that no sane person who knows the risk would, really does suggest that perhaps selling such a bike now that we've seen the risks, is very irresponsible. I hope they get a huge settlement or judgment that makes all e-bike makers reconsider the position on the spectrum of cheap vs. safe that they have chosen.

taeric 3y ago
There is no evidence that the spec of the bike factored into, though? And if they just wanted to send a message to the bike company, why sue the other girl? Really, that last point really hits me poorly.
michaelteter 3y ago
If you watch many bike shows on youtube, you'll see that a lot of storebought bikes have woefully lacking brakes and usually need proper adjustment frequently to keep them working as good as they possibly can. And even well designed bikes can have failures when used outside of their expected scenarios (broken seatposts, handlebars). Most bike owners don't even think about bike maintenance unless something obvious is broken. Heck, car parking brakes can fail on hills, so drivers need to know to turn their front wheels the right way to help prevent a runaway car. Many car parking brakes aren't designed for steep hills. Is the car maker at fault if the parking brake fails in an abnormal environment? Some bikes with caliper brakes can have tire failures due to rim heating from long downhill braking. And a blown front tire could lead to a bad crash. Are the bike makers, wheel makers, brake makers, and tire makers at fault here too? Or perhaps California should be sued for making a road that's too steep? As for rich people not suing because they need more money... these people sued their daughter's friend's family. How is that going to help? All that will do is add salt to the wound the living child probably has. In fact, it's just evil to do that to the other kid.

briHass 3y ago

As horrible as it is to imagine losing a child, what I can't imagine is ever suing private individuals, neighbors, over what is clearly an accident. The other girl was only superficially harmed from the crash, so it's likely their daughter's death was one of those freak cases: hit her head just right even though she had a helmet on. Most active kids probably engage in activities that have a non-zero chance of death or serious injury on a regular basis. 99.999% of the time, if injuries result, they are minor, but there's always going to be a few instances where the outcome is horrific. Society is worse because of the lawsuit (and fear of lawsuit) culture this type of behavior results in.

tnecniv 3y ago
Every few years you hear about a kid dying playing baseball (the last major league death was almost a century ago despite the ball flying around a lot faster and hundreds of thousands of games are played by people of all ages every year). It’s certainly awful, but imagine suing the league over a freak comeback hit.