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It is so strange that donors and alumni can put pressure on schools to fire coaching staff in athletics programs to make schools perform better. Yet when it com

It is so strange that donors and alumni can put pressure on schools to fire coaching staff in athletics programs to make schools perform better. Yet when it comes to the administrative bloat and waste alumni don’t hold their schools to the same standard. Like academic degradation is something no one cares about.

godzillabrennus 3y ago
Athletic programs can make serious money for a school
- fragmede 3y ago
  Serious, directly measurable money for the school. If I graduate with a degree and that degree gets me a career that goes exceedingly well and I become a 10 or 100-millionaire, and donate money for a lab to the university, that's not exactly trackable to that one really good professor. Meanwhile, the coach who won the big game is well known.
  - solardev 3y ago
    This is so silly. We make our educators beholden to businesspeople who run sporting arenas so we can still charge our kids tens of thousands of dollars to spend 4+ years of their life on something that has maybe a 50% chance of paying itself back over time. Meanwhile other countries just fund public education and subsidize tuition. shrug
    - Ylpertnodi 3y ago
      Sadly, several persons in non-US countries are rubbing their hands with jealousy, thinking about the US system. To some, it's a thing to be admired.
      - fragmede 3y ago
        We see that across the world; countries gutting governmental services which enriches their cronys and ultimately hurts the users of the service. The NHS, programs for addicts in Portugal, I'm sure there are others.
- UweSchmidt 3y ago
  Automatic comment whenever univerity athletic programs are brought up. "It makes money", with the implication "..therefore it is all good" not even spelled out. The original intent was to offer a well-rounded education that includes physical activity. Healthy body healthy mind. Nerds who are also in shape. This concept is lost by creating a pro athlete caste within a school, students more respected for their success on the field than in the classroom. Maybe sports is truly subsidizing academics, but then again if 280 Million are spent on this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQIGwxsVv1E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQIGwxsVv1E, is there enough institutional focus on academics? Ok correct me if I'm ignorant on this topic but give me more than that oneliner that I've read a couple times before.
- manicennui 3y ago
  Why does this matter if most of the money is going to the sports program and tuition remains unaffordable?
bombcar 3y ago
When you're working as a donor, administrative bloat is who you're working with. But many big donors only care about how the school does athletically. They don't care about the education side - and in fact, if they could figure a way to ditch that "cost center" they would.
- internet101010 3y ago
  A lot of people misinterpret the term "cost center" mean an area of a business that only spends money (e.g. marketing department) but that isn't what it is at all. Probably because it has the word "cost" in it. A cost center is simply a vessel through which money moves. Revenue, expenses, inventory, etc. all go through cost centers. Sure, the professors' salaries go through a cost center. So does tuition and royalties from TV networks.
  - blindhippo 3y ago
    This is true in an accounting sense, but generally speaking most people are referring to the definition of "cost-center" as a business unit that does not generate revenue directly, in contrast to a "profit-center" which does. This isn't a misinterpretation, it's just a different definition of the term based on context.
  - CSMastermind 3y ago
    Is marketing a good example? I feel like the whole point of marketing is to generate revenue for the business, albeit indirectly. Maintenance on your building, IT infrastructure, etc. are more of what I think of. The "cost of doing business". Basically, things you need to have for the business to function but spending more on them won't generate you more revenue, sales, etc.
    - killjoywashere 3y ago
      Profit centers directly produce profit. Cost centers may indirectly produce profit but the administration has a fundamentally different view of the assets. To wit: the leadership of a profit center could molest children and the administration would not notice (this is literally the source of countless headlines), while the leadership of a cost center could get staffing slashed if they use too many post-it notes (this is the source of no headlines ever).
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
dfxm12 3y ago
Sports are very heavily reported on, for many reasons. In some states, a university football coach is the highest paid public sector employee. Do we really know what else goes on behind closed doors in terms of donor pressure?
callalex 3y ago
I applied pressure by refusing to donate, and citing administrative bloat as the reason. I know I’m not alone. I doubt they’ll listen because the absence of dollars is hard to quantify.
scythe 3y ago
If you think it's so easy to measure academic bloat, why not go do it? Someone should start an index of wasteful spending by university or something.
- darth_avocado 3y ago
  Give me the access to the books and I’ll do it.

godzillabrennus 3y ago

Athletic programs can make serious money for a school

fragmede 3y ago
Serious, directly measurable money for the school. If I graduate with a degree and that degree gets me a career that goes exceedingly well and I become a 10 or 100-millionaire, and donate money for a lab to the university, that's not exactly trackable to that one really good professor. Meanwhile, the coach who won the big game is well known.
- solardev 3y ago
  This is so silly. We make our educators beholden to businesspeople who run sporting arenas so we can still charge our kids tens of thousands of dollars to spend 4+ years of their life on something that has maybe a 50% chance of paying itself back over time. Meanwhile other countries just fund public education and subsidize tuition. shrug
  - Ylpertnodi 3y ago
    Sadly, several persons in non-US countries are rubbing their hands with jealousy, thinking about the US system. To some, it's a thing to be admired.
    - fragmede 3y ago
      We see that across the world; countries gutting governmental services which enriches their cronys and ultimately hurts the users of the service. The NHS, programs for addicts in Portugal, I'm sure there are others.
UweSchmidt 3y ago
Automatic comment whenever univerity athletic programs are brought up. "It makes money", with the implication "..therefore it is all good" not even spelled out. The original intent was to offer a well-rounded education that includes physical activity. Healthy body healthy mind. Nerds who are also in shape. This concept is lost by creating a pro athlete caste within a school, students more respected for their success on the field than in the classroom. Maybe sports is truly subsidizing academics, but then again if 280 Million are spent on this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQIGwxsVv1E https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQIGwxsVv1E, is there enough institutional focus on academics? Ok correct me if I'm ignorant on this topic but give me more than that oneliner that I've read a couple times before.
manicennui 3y ago
Why does this matter if most of the money is going to the sports program and tuition remains unaffordable?

bombcar 3y ago

When you're working as a donor, administrative bloat is who you're working with. But many big donors only care about how the school does athletically. They don't care about the education side - and in fact, if they could figure a way to ditch that "cost center" they would.

internet101010 3y ago
A lot of people misinterpret the term "cost center" mean an area of a business that only spends money (e.g. marketing department) but that isn't what it is at all. Probably because it has the word "cost" in it. A cost center is simply a vessel through which money moves. Revenue, expenses, inventory, etc. all go through cost centers. Sure, the professors' salaries go through a cost center. So does tuition and royalties from TV networks.
- blindhippo 3y ago
  This is true in an accounting sense, but generally speaking most people are referring to the definition of "cost-center" as a business unit that does not generate revenue directly, in contrast to a "profit-center" which does. This isn't a misinterpretation, it's just a different definition of the term based on context.
- CSMastermind 3y ago
  Is marketing a good example? I feel like the whole point of marketing is to generate revenue for the business, albeit indirectly. Maintenance on your building, IT infrastructure, etc. are more of what I think of. The "cost of doing business". Basically, things you need to have for the business to function but spending more on them won't generate you more revenue, sales, etc.
  - killjoywashere 3y ago
    Profit centers directly produce profit. Cost centers may indirectly produce profit but the administration has a fundamentally different view of the assets. To wit: the leadership of a profit center could molest children and the administration would not notice (this is literally the source of countless headlines), while the leadership of a cost center could get staffing slashed if they use too many post-it notes (this is the source of no headlines ever).

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

dfxm12 3y ago

Sports are very heavily reported on, for many reasons. In some states, a university football coach is the highest paid public sector employee. Do we really know what else goes on behind closed doors in terms of donor pressure?

callalex 3y ago

I applied pressure by refusing to donate, and citing administrative bloat as the reason. I know I’m not alone. I doubt they’ll listen because the absence of dollars is hard to quantify.

scythe 3y ago

If you think it's so easy to measure academic bloat, why not go do it? Someone should start an index of wasteful spending by university or something.

darth_avocado 3y ago
Give me the access to the books and I’ll do it.