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> The main difference being that issues in California are generally handled via civil suit, while Germany handles them through a government board. That sounds

by Lewton 3y ago

> The main difference being that issues in California are generally handled via civil suit, while Germany handles them through a government board. That sounds like a pretty big difference, and not one that favours california. Having to lawyer up is a big barrier?

ilikehurdles 3y ago
And do you think this changes safety standards, which was this the original claim? It may change reporting standards, but whether one workplace is safer than the other probably depends on the perceived risk to the company in either place. Is it costlier to have American lawyers sniffing for blood in your factory, or the German bureaucracy processing reports for paper cuts and lost limbs alike? I’m not making a claim one way or another, just that more info is needed in this conversation.
- cf141q5325 3y ago
  In Germany many technical jobs entail personal liability, so the lever is against the individuals, not against the company. As such pressuring people into skipping safety standards is a no go. You risk prison time and painful fines the company cant officially help with.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
deaddodo 3y ago
Well, that has no effect on the standards themself, just the onus of execution. So it's a moot point. That being said the government will step in when things are obviously non-conforming, if you'd rather just report them. Which is the case for Tesla. As to your latter point, labor suits are pretty heavily in favor of the worker and it's not hard to find a lawyer who will take a case on concession. Fees are also capped, delayed to completion and generally on the losing party to cover. So "the barrier" is as low as you want to consider the solidity of the case. Considering worker's comp and civil suit structuring are the two pieces of legislation that are most heavily attacked by corporations in California, I wouldn't consider them ineffective; it's certainly a matter of perspective, however.

by Lewton 3y ago

ilikehurdles 3y ago

And do you think this changes safety standards, which was this the original claim? It may change reporting standards, but whether one workplace is safer than the other probably depends on the perceived risk to the company in either place. Is it costlier to have American lawyers sniffing for blood in your factory, or the German bureaucracy processing reports for paper cuts and lost limbs alike? I’m not making a claim one way or another, just that more info is needed in this conversation.

cf141q5325 3y ago
In Germany many technical jobs entail personal liability, so the lever is against the individuals, not against the company. As such pressuring people into skipping safety standards is a no go. You risk prison time and painful fines the company cant officially help with.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

deaddodo 3y ago

Well, that has no effect on the standards themself, just the onus of execution. So it's a moot point. That being said the government will step in when things are obviously non-conforming, if you'd rather just report them. Which is the case for Tesla. As to your latter point, labor suits are pretty heavily in favor of the worker and it's not hard to find a lawyer who will take a case on concession. Fees are also capped, delayed to completion and generally on the losing party to cover. So "the barrier" is as low as you want to consider the solidity of the case. Considering worker's comp and civil suit structuring are the two pieces of legislation that are most heavily attacked by corporations in California, I wouldn't consider them ineffective; it's certainly a matter of perspective, however.