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I mean, you could, but that would get really gross when implementing certain scales that are nowhere similar to the MIDI tuning (like working out the fractions

I mean, you could, but that would get really gross when implementing certain scales that are nowhere similar to the MIDI tuning (like working out the fractions for a 13-note scale)

elihu 3y ago
Eh, it's fine. With two decimal points of precision you're basically working in cents, which is a pretty standard way of representing tuning. This doesn't need to be a trivially human-readable format, but I think maybe it would be nice to allow for multiple pitch representations: floating point frequency, floating point fractions of a semitone in any arbitrary EDO, fractional frequency as used in just intonation, etc.. You could also allow for annotations, like maybe a note pitch is represented as "63.86" in 12-EDO, but it's not just some weird in-between note, it's actually the E that's 5/4 above C, so the file could have an annotation that says that's what the note actually means in this context.
- AlecSchueler 3y ago
  Isn't the issue that pitch bends in midi apply to every sound on that channel, so if you play a chord with a different temperament and send the bend data of each note the result is that the whole chord will be tempered as normal but with every note the same amount higher or lower? I've heard the recent midi 2 can get around this but it's still a pain with the 40 years of midi equipment that surrounds us.
  - elihu 3y ago
    Yes, that's a problem with MIDI 1.0. There are a few ways to work around it. Some synths support custom tuning tables, and there's even a MIDI spec for custom tuning tables called MTS that hardly anyone actually implements as far as I know. One way that works for multitimbral synth (which a lot of 90's romplers are) is to only play one note at a time on each channel, and use multiple channels for polyphony. This allows you to individually control the pitch of every note. The one-note-per-channel trick works okay, but it's kind of awkward. If you want to use all 16 channels, it means setting every channel to the exact same patch, which is tedious. Also, you have to know what the pitch bend range of the synth is if you want to bend by the exact right amount. So, eventually MPE was adopted as an official MIDI standard to provide an easier, more user-friendly and standardized way to do one-note-per-channel MIDI. MIDI 2.0 has added per-note pitch bend. For anyone making microtonal instruments right now, though, I'd say MPE is probably the best/easiest option.
    - AlecSchueler 3y ago
      Thanks, that sas a helpful response and I'll surely have a fun time looking into these different potential solutions.

I mean, you could, but that would get really gross when implementing certain scales that are nowhere similar to the MIDI tuning (like working out the fractions for a 13-note scale)

elihu 3y ago

Eh, it's fine. With two decimal points of precision you're basically working in cents, which is a pretty standard way of representing tuning. This doesn't need to be a trivially human-readable format, but I think maybe it would be nice to allow for multiple pitch representations: floating point frequency, floating point fractions of a semitone in any arbitrary EDO, fractional frequency as used in just intonation, etc.. You could also allow for annotations, like maybe a note pitch is represented as "63.86" in 12-EDO, but it's not just some weird in-between note, it's actually the E that's 5/4 above C, so the file could have an annotation that says that's what the note actually means in this context.

AlecSchueler 3y ago
Isn't the issue that pitch bends in midi apply to every sound on that channel, so if you play a chord with a different temperament and send the bend data of each note the result is that the whole chord will be tempered as normal but with every note the same amount higher or lower? I've heard the recent midi 2 can get around this but it's still a pain with the 40 years of midi equipment that surrounds us.
- elihu 3y ago
  Yes, that's a problem with MIDI 1.0. There are a few ways to work around it. Some synths support custom tuning tables, and there's even a MIDI spec for custom tuning tables called MTS that hardly anyone actually implements as far as I know. One way that works for multitimbral synth (which a lot of 90's romplers are) is to only play one note at a time on each channel, and use multiple channels for polyphony. This allows you to individually control the pitch of every note. The one-note-per-channel trick works okay, but it's kind of awkward. If you want to use all 16 channels, it means setting every channel to the exact same patch, which is tedious. Also, you have to know what the pitch bend range of the synth is if you want to bend by the exact right amount. So, eventually MPE was adopted as an official MIDI standard to provide an easier, more user-friendly and standardized way to do one-note-per-channel MIDI. MIDI 2.0 has added per-note pitch bend. For anyone making microtonal instruments right now, though, I'd say MPE is probably the best/easiest option.
  - AlecSchueler 3y ago
    Thanks, that sas a helpful response and I'll surely have a fun time looking into these different potential solutions.