3 ms·

> I think he is just saying even if you legalize it and allow addicts to get drugs easily, it’s not viable long term as the addicts will develop tolerance to th

> I think he is just saying even if you legalize it and allow addicts to get drugs easily, it’s not viable long term as the addicts will develop tolerance to the drugs and will need ever increasing doses. Right, and that's not true, because that's not how addiction actually works.

TerrifiedMouse 3y ago
Based on a quick reading of a few health websites, there is a difference between drug tolerance, dependence, and addiction. Can tolerance result in withdrawal when dependence is present? Probably not? No one has mentioned it anyway. If so a person who has developed tolerance and dependence on a drug will just not feel any of the effects when they take it but will feel withdrawal effects when they stop. Addiction is a different can of worms though. If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings.
- stingrae 3y ago
  "If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings." This is exactly what I'm afraid of. Especially when it is very easy to overdose on fentanyl.
  - gwbas1c 3y ago
    One very important reason to legalize access to opioids is for quality control. The main reason why overdoses occur is because street drug potency is unknown, and because street drug potency can be inconsistent within the same batch. (IE, if my black market "heroin" is really powdered fentanyl mixed in a gel, if I don't mix it well the fentanyl will clump, and the clumps could kill someone.)
- chimeracoder 3y ago
  > Based on a quick reading of a few health websites, there is a difference between drug tolerance, dependence, and addiction. Just to be clear here, I'm speaking from a position of much more domain knowledge than "a quick reading of a few health websites". > If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings. This, along with the entire trichotomy you've presented, is incorrect. It may surprise you to know that this is a topic that has been quite extensively researched, and there are mountains of clinical data on the topic. Maintenance doses aren't "ever-increasing" - they're fixed.
  - TerrifiedMouse 3y ago
    > I'm speaking from a position of much more domain knowledge than "a quick reading of a few health websites". Pardon me. It’s hard to tell since your original post was pretty low on content. “No you are wrong” isn’t very insightful. > Maintenance doses aren't "ever-increasing" - they're fixed. Does this work for addiction or just dependence? Can we see some of the “mountains of clinical data on the topic”?
    - gwbas1c 3y ago
      Chimeracoder already put it in this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37679129 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37679129

TerrifiedMouse 3y ago

Based on a quick reading of a few health websites, there is a difference between drug tolerance, dependence, and addiction. Can tolerance result in withdrawal when dependence is present? Probably not? No one has mentioned it anyway. If so a person who has developed tolerance and dependence on a drug will just not feel any of the effects when they take it but will feel withdrawal effects when they stop. Addiction is a different can of worms though. If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings.

stingrae 3y ago
"If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings." This is exactly what I'm afraid of. Especially when it is very easy to overdose on fentanyl.
- gwbas1c 3y ago
  One very important reason to legalize access to opioids is for quality control. The main reason why overdoses occur is because street drug potency is unknown, and because street drug potency can be inconsistent within the same batch. (IE, if my black market "heroin" is really powdered fentanyl mixed in a gel, if I don't mix it well the fentanyl will clump, and the clumps could kill someone.)
chimeracoder 3y ago
> Based on a quick reading of a few health websites, there is a difference between drug tolerance, dependence, and addiction. Just to be clear here, I'm speaking from a position of much more domain knowledge than "a quick reading of a few health websites". > If addicts crave the effects of the drug and won’t be satisfied otherwise, then tolerance is a problem for them and they will require ever higher doses to stop the cravings. This, along with the entire trichotomy you've presented, is incorrect. It may surprise you to know that this is a topic that has been quite extensively researched, and there are mountains of clinical data on the topic. Maintenance doses aren't "ever-increasing" - they're fixed.
- TerrifiedMouse 3y ago
  > I'm speaking from a position of much more domain knowledge than "a quick reading of a few health websites". Pardon me. It’s hard to tell since your original post was pretty low on content. “No you are wrong” isn’t very insightful. > Maintenance doses aren't "ever-increasing" - they're fixed. Does this work for addiction or just dependence? Can we see some of the “mountains of clinical data on the topic”?
  - gwbas1c 3y ago
    Chimeracoder already put it in this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37679129 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37679129