3 ms·

Huh? I use my phone to take photos and read. No hoop jumping or dancing for Apple required.

dns_snek 3y ago
Well you argued that paying Apple $100/year to install software of your choice on a device that you supposedly own constitutes "software freedom". I argue that this is perversion of the word "freedom" considering it's neither free as beer, nor free as speech. Ultimately you're still forced to ask Apple for permission to run your "sideloaded" app, and they can deny that request for any reason. "Software freedom" that you mockingly refer to is just a slightly longer leash inside the confines of their walled garden.
- a-user-you-like 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - dns_snek 3y ago
    I'm merely pointing out that there is no "software freedom" in Apple's ecosystem, just an illusion of one, and even that's locked behind a steep fee. tldr (which is apparently needed); don't piss on me and tell me it's raining.
    - a-user-you-like 3y ago
      [flagged]
- shuckles 3y ago
  You can sideload for free. You have to press a button to renew your local signature every week. The $100/year is to skip pressing the button. You don’t have to get permission to run locally signed apps.
  - idle_zealot 3y ago
    > You don’t have to get permission to run locally signed apps You absolutely do need permission, that's how Apple enforces the app expiration. Apple will grant you a developer account and sign your apps for local use, but you cannot load your own apps without them doing so.
    - shuckles 3y ago
      Any app that Xcode can build will be signed to run on the phone. There’s no permission required in any meaningful sense.
      - dns_snek 3y ago
        1. Valid Xcode signature is subject to Apple's approval. They might blanket approve everything now, but they could pull that rug tomorrow if they wanted to. 2. Having to re-sign every 7 days is a completely unworkable proposal, it means that you can't be away from your Mac for more than a week or the apps that you rely on will just stop working 3. Most people don't own a Mac, much less the have knowledge to sign apps with Xcode, for this to even be a realistic proposal
        shuckles 3y ago
        1. Then tomorrow you could argue human rights are violated. Not today. 2. So like I said: being able to run whatever software you want for more than a week at a time without having to click a button is the human right? Is that so? 2+3. I propose you start a human rights defending company that rents people a Mac Mini in the cloud for a minute a week and auto-signs any locally signed apps. All the necessary API already exists, and the marginal cost is in the cents. Cheapest welfare ever!
        Apocryphon 3y ago
        They would have to rent for longer than that, per the SLA: https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOSVentura.pdf https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOSVentura.pdf > 3. Leasing for Permitted Developer Services. (ii) each lease period must be for a minimum period of twenty-four (24) consecutive hours; It also depends on whether auto-signing qualifies as a Permitted Developer Service, which sounds like it might- > (B) Permitted Developer Services means continuous integration services, including but not limited to software development, building software from source, automated testing during software development, and running necessary developer tools to support such activities.

Well you argued that paying Apple $100/year to install software of your choice on a device that you supposedly own constitutes "software freedom". I argue that this is perversion of the word "freedom" considering it's neither free as beer, nor free as speech. Ultimately you're still forced to ask Apple for permission to run your "sideloaded" app, and they can deny that request for any reason. "Software freedom" that you mockingly refer to is just a slightly longer leash inside the confines of their walled garden.

a-user-you-like 3y ago
[flagged]
- dns_snek 3y ago
  I'm merely pointing out that there is no "software freedom" in Apple's ecosystem, just an illusion of one, and even that's locked behind a steep fee. tldr (which is apparently needed); don't piss on me and tell me it's raining.
  - a-user-you-like 3y ago
    [flagged]
shuckles 3y ago
You can sideload for free. You have to press a button to renew your local signature every week. The $100/year is to skip pressing the button. You don’t have to get permission to run locally signed apps.
- idle_zealot 3y ago
  > You don’t have to get permission to run locally signed apps You absolutely do need permission, that's how Apple enforces the app expiration. Apple will grant you a developer account and sign your apps for local use, but you cannot load your own apps without them doing so.
  - shuckles 3y ago
    Any app that Xcode can build will be signed to run on the phone. There’s no permission required in any meaningful sense.
    - dns_snek 3y ago
      1. Valid Xcode signature is subject to Apple's approval. They might blanket approve everything now, but they could pull that rug tomorrow if they wanted to. 2. Having to re-sign every 7 days is a completely unworkable proposal, it means that you can't be away from your Mac for more than a week or the apps that you rely on will just stop working 3. Most people don't own a Mac, much less the have knowledge to sign apps with Xcode, for this to even be a realistic proposal
      - shuckles 3y ago
        1. Then tomorrow you could argue human rights are violated. Not today. 2. So like I said: being able to run whatever software you want for more than a week at a time without having to click a button is the human right? Is that so? 2+3. I propose you start a human rights defending company that rents people a Mac Mini in the cloud for a minute a week and auto-signs any locally signed apps. All the necessary API already exists, and the marginal cost is in the cents. Cheapest welfare ever!
        Apocryphon 3y ago
        They would have to rent for longer than that, per the SLA: https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOSVentura.pdf https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOSVentura.pdf > 3. Leasing for Permitted Developer Services. (ii) each lease period must be for a minimum period of twenty-four (24) consecutive hours; It also depends on whether auto-signing qualifies as a Permitted Developer Service, which sounds like it might- > (B) Permitted Developer Services means continuous integration services, including but not limited to software development, building software from source, automated testing during software development, and running necessary developer tools to support such activities.