4 ms·

I hate the term "enshittification". I cringe everytime I see it and it's kind of disgusting too. Why couldn't it just be " worsening"? ...

marcod 3y ago
Because it has a much more specific meaning than worsening :)
benterix 3y ago
You can use "platform decay" instead.
- Amasuriel 3y ago
  Decay implies simple neglect, vs deliberate actions that make the platforms or systems worse, sometimes out of incompetence, but often because the companies objectives no longer align with the customers.
Brian_K_White 3y ago
I'm only tired that it's so overused. But taken as originally used by one guy one time, it is perfectly fine, and "worsening" is worse. Enshittification, before it became a Flaming Moe, has imagination and life. Worsening has neither. Humans, or at least, I, are not mere data processing devices. Mere dictionary correctness is not enough to convey an idea, and especially not enough for that idea to have any impact. If Cory wrote and spoke that BORING, he would be like all the other perfectly correct and perfectly ignored.
- sureglymop 3y ago
  Reading your comment, I do agree. Another thing though is that I cannot really use the word outside of the "Hacker News/Tech" scene. If I want to speak to someone who isn't online as much and not in the loop I have to use "worsening" or something else anyway.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    I don't use the term often, but I've used it with normal people (as opposed to tech people), and every time, they've instantly understood what I meant.
  - Brian_K_White 3y ago
    encrappification But sure, there are countless things I too don't say a certain way or even whole topics I don't discuss at all depending on who I'm talking to or in what context. You can also just blame it on him. You can say it, and say this guy said this instead of just saying it directly. I do that I guess just for the lack of imagination reason. I hate repeating someone else so I haven't actually adopted the word in my own speaking, so if I were to talk about the topic with someone, I'd probably say this guy said it this way and it's perfect... I said it's perfect and yet I distanced myself.
trilbyglens 3y ago
You seem like the type of person who uses the word "inappropriate" a lot.
- sureglymop 3y ago
  Not really. I'm a nonnative English speaker, maybe that's why it invokes a gross image in my imagination. Having that said, very inappropriate of you to make assumptions about me ;)
javcasas 3y ago
Enshittification is a very special kind of worsening. Enshittification is the transformation of a platform from serving its users to serving MBAs and middle managers of the owning company.
- nonrandomstring 3y ago
  Cory does use "enshitification" to mean a specific bait-and-switch tactic in which companies offer a free product for years, corner a market, and then abuse their trapped user base. It's sassy. But specifics are most useful in writing that has durability as well as aesthetic power. People reading in 10 years won't necessarily get what "enshitification" means. Instead I prefer to talk about: Hijack. It's pretty common for BigTech to take over a company or service and hold it hostage. Sabotage. The deliberate breaking of standards, dumbing down of information, reduction of capabilities. Most often when BigTech interacts with an existing system it leaves it much worse of functionally. Betrayal. Quite simply BigTech is treacherous. Whatever faith or loyalty long-standing users have the company will sell them for a dime, break promises, lie and steal whatever data they like. And we could go on with many timeless names for harms perpetrated by these aggressive and socially derelict companies - but my point is that it pays to pause for a moment and think about the deeper nature of the harms to find the best word for what's really happening.
- svilen_dobrev 3y ago
  it's about kind-of watering-down any value and substituting it with something "free"-beer-like (but for which you "pay" giving away your kidneys. or kids)
JohnFen 3y ago
> and it's kind of disgusting too That's part of what makes it a good term. It's a disgusting thing, and deserving of a name that reminds us of that.
m463 3y ago
"Worsening" would be a euphemism, and a mild one at that. Do you want to end up minimizing in that way, maybe like spy movies saying "sanctioning" instead of "murdering"? That said, I see your side of the point. I see people calling the police "thugs" and my judgement falls on the people doing the name calling. So, I don't know the answer. maybe it is to choose a better strong term, like corruption.

marcod 3y ago

Because it has a much more specific meaning than worsening :)

benterix 3y ago

You can use "platform decay" instead.

Amasuriel 3y ago
Decay implies simple neglect, vs deliberate actions that make the platforms or systems worse, sometimes out of incompetence, but often because the companies objectives no longer align with the customers.

Brian_K_White 3y ago

I'm only tired that it's so overused. But taken as originally used by one guy one time, it is perfectly fine, and "worsening" is worse. Enshittification, before it became a Flaming Moe, has imagination and life. Worsening has neither. Humans, or at least, I, are not mere data processing devices. Mere dictionary correctness is not enough to convey an idea, and especially not enough for that idea to have any impact. If Cory wrote and spoke that BORING, he would be like all the other perfectly correct and perfectly ignored.

sureglymop 3y ago
Reading your comment, I do agree. Another thing though is that I cannot really use the word outside of the "Hacker News/Tech" scene. If I want to speak to someone who isn't online as much and not in the loop I have to use "worsening" or something else anyway.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  I don't use the term often, but I've used it with normal people (as opposed to tech people), and every time, they've instantly understood what I meant.
- Brian_K_White 3y ago
  encrappification But sure, there are countless things I too don't say a certain way or even whole topics I don't discuss at all depending on who I'm talking to or in what context. You can also just blame it on him. You can say it, and say this guy said this instead of just saying it directly. I do that I guess just for the lack of imagination reason. I hate repeating someone else so I haven't actually adopted the word in my own speaking, so if I were to talk about the topic with someone, I'd probably say this guy said it this way and it's perfect... I said it's perfect and yet I distanced myself.

trilbyglens 3y ago

You seem like the type of person who uses the word "inappropriate" a lot.

sureglymop 3y ago
Not really. I'm a nonnative English speaker, maybe that's why it invokes a gross image in my imagination. Having that said, very inappropriate of you to make assumptions about me ;)

javcasas 3y ago

Enshittification is a very special kind of worsening. Enshittification is the transformation of a platform from serving its users to serving MBAs and middle managers of the owning company.

nonrandomstring 3y ago
Cory does use "enshitification" to mean a specific bait-and-switch tactic in which companies offer a free product for years, corner a market, and then abuse their trapped user base. It's sassy. But specifics are most useful in writing that has durability as well as aesthetic power. People reading in 10 years won't necessarily get what "enshitification" means. Instead I prefer to talk about: Hijack. It's pretty common for BigTech to take over a company or service and hold it hostage. Sabotage. The deliberate breaking of standards, dumbing down of information, reduction of capabilities. Most often when BigTech interacts with an existing system it leaves it much worse of functionally. Betrayal. Quite simply BigTech is treacherous. Whatever faith or loyalty long-standing users have the company will sell them for a dime, break promises, lie and steal whatever data they like. And we could go on with many timeless names for harms perpetrated by these aggressive and socially derelict companies - but my point is that it pays to pause for a moment and think about the deeper nature of the harms to find the best word for what's really happening.
svilen_dobrev 3y ago
it's about kind-of watering-down any value and substituting it with something "free"-beer-like (but for which you "pay" giving away your kidneys. or kids)

JohnFen 3y ago

> and it's kind of disgusting too That's part of what makes it a good term. It's a disgusting thing, and deserving of a name that reminds us of that.

m463 3y ago

"Worsening" would be a euphemism, and a mild one at that. Do you want to end up minimizing in that way, maybe like spy movies saying "sanctioning" instead of "murdering"? That said, I see your side of the point. I see people calling the police "thugs" and my judgement falls on the people doing the name calling. So, I don't know the answer. maybe it is to choose a better strong term, like corruption.