11 ms·

Lego Says It Won't Use Recycled Plastic Because It Doesnt Help the Planet

31 points by cfcfcf 3y ago

huytersd 3y ago
This is an interesting thing to publicly post (though it might be true) given their business involves pumping out millions of tonnes of fresh plastic that will probably end up in the environment over time. If I was in their PR department I would try to not draw any attention to myself in this space.
- fsloth 3y ago
  ”that will probably end up in the environment over time.” A few brick here and there, for sure. I have 40 year old Lego blocks in my house. Unless the quality has degraded severely that plastic will be used for decades. The problem with plastic is cheap packaging that is designed to be thrown away by the consumer at the first instance.
  - huytersd 3y ago
    Well anecdotally my mom threw out all of my Lego once I left home. It’s not something I miss because I didn’t really use them much. Using Lego to build things always felt like cheating, like you’re building a preassembled kit (which you are). I always preferred to make things out of “raw materials” like wood, metal, cardboard etc.
    - fsloth 3y ago
      "mom threw out all of my Lego once I left home" I guess she wasn't aware of the vibrant resale market?
      - huytersd 3y ago
        No ha, and apparently neither was I until right now.
      - Supernaut 3y ago
        This is news to me too. Now that my kids are older, last year I decided to clear some space in what had been their playroom by finding a new home for the small mountain of Lego that we had accumulated. I rang around local schools and charities but no one was in the slightest bit interested. In the end I had to sadly take the lot to landfill.
        fsloth 3y ago
        Oh, super interesting from point of view of market segmentation. Where do you live? Urban or rural? It does seem the prices of unorganized mounds of blocks is quite cheap nowadays (10-20 EUR/kg seems to be the going rate via quick ebay survey). Maybe those decades of non-obsolescense are saturating the market. Definetly not land-fill prices yet, though.
  - lb1lf 3y ago
    This. My kids are now the third generation enjoying the same Lego bricks. The oldest were bought by my great grandparents for my father, so these toys already involve five generations and probably will still be used for at least another couple of generations. As far as sustainability goes, Legos are incredible.
syndicatedjelly 3y ago
It's so rare for a company to actually do the research to see if their greenwashing campaign is actually doing anything for the environment. This is great to see
vlz 3y ago
> the material didn’t reduce carbon emissions Good on them for checking that, but aren't there additional concerns with plastics, e.g. reducing the amount of microplastics in the environment?
- yodon 3y ago
  Lego isn't micro. That's why it hurts to step on it with bare feet.
  - Smoosh 3y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caltrop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caltrop
    - LoganDark 3y ago
      legos are worse
  - deepsummer 3y ago
    Some pieces are, and many are close. Microplastic is defined as pieces < 5mm.
- sp332 3y ago
  You really have to put some wear on a piece of plastic to get microplastic particles. Washing polyester clothes and driving cars on "rubber" tires for example.
  - defrost 3y ago
    Or sun exposure - many large chunky plastic items become brittle and fragment after years in the sun. Then there's shadecloth - literally tens of hundreds of thousands of kilometres of shadecloth woven from plastic fibres that all eventually goes rotten and is replaced. Tearing old shadecloth down sends tonnes of microplastic into the environment after what frayed and blew away while it was up. https://www.sagehort.com.au/horticultural-materials/shadecloth/page/2 https://www.sagehort.com.au/horticultural-materials/shadeclo...
sircastor 3y ago
I was just chatting with friends about my misgivings of gifting Lego sets to my kid. He absolutely loves building them and I enjoy serving as building assistant to him. But Lego makes thousands of pounds of new plastic toys every year. I’m not sure I want to support that. We’re looking at buying used bricks in bulk, and you can find instructions online. But then you’re bidding against everyone else.
- accrual 3y ago
  If this references buying on eBay, couldn't one just filter by Buy It Now?
- fsloth 3y ago
  ”Lego makes thousands of pounds of new plastic toys every year.” There is nothing inherently wrong about plastic. Plastic waste is the problem. Cheap plastic waste. In general Lego - is used for decades - is not cheap Plastic has it’s uses. It’s not inherently evil. Lego’s use of plastic is the best kind. There is nothing wrong in supporting Lego.
  - stevage 3y ago
    That doesn't mean there's nothing wrong with it. It still consumes a non renewable resource, and a lot of Lego still ends up in the environment or landfills.
    - fsloth 3y ago
      "It still consumes a non renewable resource..." As does most of our current industrial processes. I really can't see beyond blind value signaling why anyone would want to single out Lego. "It's a really familiar brand and uses plastics - let's take them down a notch". Far too easy and also misplaced. If all companies made their products as lasting as Lego we would have lot less problems. Lego should be held as an aspirational role model, not a pariah.
      - ranguna 3y ago
squokko 3y ago
Changing anything about Lego would be monumentally stupid. The stuff is essentially perfect and has been for decades.
EGreg 3y ago
Look, I do realize that "recycling plastic" for years was just "ship to China / Mexico", so it was all a giant scam that the government helped the plastic industry perpetuate: https://magarshak.com/blog/?p=362 https://magarshak.com/blog/?p=362 But... this struck me as weird. Recycling plastic doesn't need to help reduce carbon emissions, but rather, reduce non-biodegradeable waste that will outnumber fish by 2050: https://www.plasticsoupfoundation.org/en/plastic-problem/plastic-soup/more-plastic-than-fish/ https://www.plasticsoupfoundation.org/en/plastic-problem/pla... As CBS News reports, Lego said that it “decided not to progress” with the bricks after it “found the material didn’t reduce carbon emissions, I find this whole obsession with CO2 and "carbon emissions" to be destructive because it takes away the focus from the more pressing concerns like pollution, desertification of farmland, overfishing, collapse of natural ecosystems from rainforests to kelp forests to coral reefs, plummeting populations of insects, etc. etc. That is far far more dire than ocean levels rising by a foot, or humans having to move out of arid environments. And in this case, it's almost comical that reducing plastic pollution is measured by how much it can reduce carbon emissions.
- Vervious 3y ago
  fyi carbon emissions directly causes global warming and ocean acidification, so yes, mitigating carbon emissions IS very important to help your desertification, rainforests, kelp forests, and coral reefs
  - EGreg 3y ago
    Many of these things are due to invasive species introduced by humans such as kelp forests being killed by sea urchins. Desertification has to do with capitalism and farmers racing to the bottom depleting the soil of nutrients - just like the Dust Bowl during the Great Depression wasn’t caused by global warming. Desertification has been going on for 40 years now https://www.freethink.com/energy/desertification-desert-greening https://www.freethink.com/energy/desertification-desert-gree... This is exactly what I’m talking about — we should be focusing on solving these issues without waiting for the climate change to reverse!
    - 3y ago
deepsummer 3y ago
Rather than recycling plastic, it would make more sense for Lego to include an offer to re-buy the used Lego pieces in each package, so people become aware of the resell value and don't throw them away after a few years. It may even allow them to participate in the Lego resellers market.
- sco1 3y ago
  In case you or others aren't aware, LEGO does offer a free donation program: https://lego.com/replay https://lego.com/replay
teo_zero 3y ago
No, Lego does not say it won't use recycled plastic, it won't use this specific recycled plastic, i.e. recycled PET from water bottles, as it was investigating. It is still committed to research alternative recycled plastics options.
Simulacra 3y ago
But the use of a virgin plastic means the additional production of oil. I don't understand how not using recycled plastic is better.. One requires the extraction of new raw material, the other does not.
kkoste 3y ago
Of all the plastics. LEGO plastics are probably the ones I am least worried about. Mostly because I inherited my dads LEGO sets and then my nephew inherited my LEGO sets. These are plastics that are used for generations. My bigger worry are single use plastics. But good on LEGO for researching alternatives.

31 points by cfcfcf 3y ago

This is an interesting thing to publicly post (though it might be true) given their business involves pumping out millions of tonnes of fresh plastic that will probably end up in the environment over time. If I was in their PR department I would try to not draw any attention to myself in this space.

fsloth 3y ago
”that will probably end up in the environment over time.” A few brick here and there, for sure. I have 40 year old Lego blocks in my house. Unless the quality has degraded severely that plastic will be used for decades. The problem with plastic is cheap packaging that is designed to be thrown away by the consumer at the first instance.
- huytersd 3y ago
  Well anecdotally my mom threw out all of my Lego once I left home. It’s not something I miss because I didn’t really use them much. Using Lego to build things always felt like cheating, like you’re building a preassembled kit (which you are). I always preferred to make things out of “raw materials” like wood, metal, cardboard etc.
  - fsloth 3y ago
    "mom threw out all of my Lego once I left home" I guess she wasn't aware of the vibrant resale market?
    - huytersd 3y ago
      No ha, and apparently neither was I until right now.
    - Supernaut 3y ago
      This is news to me too. Now that my kids are older, last year I decided to clear some space in what had been their playroom by finding a new home for the small mountain of Lego that we had accumulated. I rang around local schools and charities but no one was in the slightest bit interested. In the end I had to sadly take the lot to landfill.
      - fsloth 3y ago
        Oh, super interesting from point of view of market segmentation. Where do you live? Urban or rural? It does seem the prices of unorganized mounds of blocks is quite cheap nowadays (10-20 EUR/kg seems to be the going rate via quick ebay survey). Maybe those decades of non-obsolescense are saturating the market. Definetly not land-fill prices yet, though.
- lb1lf 3y ago
  This. My kids are now the third generation enjoying the same Lego bricks. The oldest were bought by my great grandparents for my father, so these toys already involve five generations and probably will still be used for at least another couple of generations. As far as sustainability goes, Legos are incredible.

syndicatedjelly 3y ago

It's so rare for a company to actually do the research to see if their greenwashing campaign is actually doing anything for the environment. This is great to see

vlz 3y ago

> the material didn’t reduce carbon emissions Good on them for checking that, but aren't there additional concerns with plastics, e.g. reducing the amount of microplastics in the environment?

yodon 3y ago
Lego isn't micro. That's why it hurts to step on it with bare feet.
- Smoosh 3y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caltrop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caltrop
  - LoganDark 3y ago
    legos are worse
- deepsummer 3y ago
  Some pieces are, and many are close. Microplastic is defined as pieces < 5mm.
sp332 3y ago
You really have to put some wear on a piece of plastic to get microplastic particles. Washing polyester clothes and driving cars on "rubber" tires for example.
- defrost 3y ago
  Or sun exposure - many large chunky plastic items become brittle and fragment after years in the sun. Then there's shadecloth - literally tens of hundreds of thousands of kilometres of shadecloth woven from plastic fibres that all eventually goes rotten and is replaced. Tearing old shadecloth down sends tonnes of microplastic into the environment after what frayed and blew away while it was up. https://www.sagehort.com.au/horticultural-materials/shadecloth/page/2 https://www.sagehort.com.au/horticultural-materials/shadeclo...

sircastor 3y ago

I was just chatting with friends about my misgivings of gifting Lego sets to my kid. He absolutely loves building them and I enjoy serving as building assistant to him. But Lego makes thousands of pounds of new plastic toys every year. I’m not sure I want to support that. We’re looking at buying used bricks in bulk, and you can find instructions online. But then you’re bidding against everyone else.

accrual 3y ago
If this references buying on eBay, couldn't one just filter by Buy It Now?
fsloth 3y ago
”Lego makes thousands of pounds of new plastic toys every year.” There is nothing inherently wrong about plastic. Plastic waste is the problem. Cheap plastic waste. In general Lego - is used for decades - is not cheap Plastic has it’s uses. It’s not inherently evil. Lego’s use of plastic is the best kind. There is nothing wrong in supporting Lego.
- stevage 3y ago
  That doesn't mean there's nothing wrong with it. It still consumes a non renewable resource, and a lot of Lego still ends up in the environment or landfills.
  - fsloth 3y ago
    "It still consumes a non renewable resource..." As does most of our current industrial processes. I really can't see beyond blind value signaling why anyone would want to single out Lego. "It's a really familiar brand and uses plastics - let's take them down a notch". Far too easy and also misplaced. If all companies made their products as lasting as Lego we would have lot less problems. Lego should be held as an aspirational role model, not a pariah.
    - ranguna 3y ago

squokko 3y ago

Changing anything about Lego would be monumentally stupid. The stuff is essentially perfect and has been for decades.

EGreg 3y ago

Look, I do realize that "recycling plastic" for years was just "ship to China / Mexico", so it was all a giant scam that the government helped the plastic industry perpetuate: https://magarshak.com/blog/?p=362 https://magarshak.com/blog/?p=362 But... this struck me as weird. Recycling plastic doesn't need to help reduce carbon emissions, but rather, reduce non-biodegradeable waste that will outnumber fish by 2050: https://www.plasticsoupfoundation.org/en/plastic-problem/plastic-soup/more-plastic-than-fish/ https://www.plasticsoupfoundation.org/en/plastic-problem/pla... As CBS News reports, Lego said that it “decided not to progress” with the bricks after it “found the material didn’t reduce carbon emissions, I find this whole obsession with CO2 and "carbon emissions" to be destructive because it takes away the focus from the more pressing concerns like pollution, desertification of farmland, overfishing, collapse of natural ecosystems from rainforests to kelp forests to coral reefs, plummeting populations of insects, etc. etc. That is far far more dire than ocean levels rising by a foot, or humans having to move out of arid environments. And in this case, it's almost comical that reducing plastic pollution is measured by how much it can reduce carbon emissions.

Vervious 3y ago
fyi carbon emissions directly causes global warming and ocean acidification, so yes, mitigating carbon emissions IS very important to help your desertification, rainforests, kelp forests, and coral reefs
- EGreg 3y ago
  Many of these things are due to invasive species introduced by humans such as kelp forests being killed by sea urchins. Desertification has to do with capitalism and farmers racing to the bottom depleting the soil of nutrients - just like the Dust Bowl during the Great Depression wasn’t caused by global warming. Desertification has been going on for 40 years now https://www.freethink.com/energy/desertification-desert-greening https://www.freethink.com/energy/desertification-desert-gree... This is exactly what I’m talking about — we should be focusing on solving these issues without waiting for the climate change to reverse!
  - 3y ago

deepsummer 3y ago

Rather than recycling plastic, it would make more sense for Lego to include an offer to re-buy the used Lego pieces in each package, so people become aware of the resell value and don't throw them away after a few years. It may even allow them to participate in the Lego resellers market.

sco1 3y ago
In case you or others aren't aware, LEGO does offer a free donation program: https://lego.com/replay https://lego.com/replay

teo_zero 3y ago

No, Lego does not say it won't use recycled plastic, it won't use this specific recycled plastic, i.e. recycled PET from water bottles, as it was investigating. It is still committed to research alternative recycled plastics options.

Simulacra 3y ago

But the use of a virgin plastic means the additional production of oil. I don't understand how not using recycled plastic is better.. One requires the extraction of new raw material, the other does not.

kkoste 3y ago

Of all the plastics. LEGO plastics are probably the ones I am least worried about. Mostly because I inherited my dads LEGO sets and then my nephew inherited my LEGO sets. These are plastics that are used for generations. My bigger worry are single use plastics. But good on LEGO for researching alternatives.