5 ms·

like getting blood from a stone... Most of those open-source companies turn "evil" stories (like IBM/redhat ) seems to follow the same pattern. IMO, there is a

like getting blood from a stone... Most of those open-source companies turn "evil" stories (like IBM/redhat ) seems to follow the same pattern. IMO, there is a limit of the amount of value one can extract from those venture. Trying to increase revenue beyond a certain limit will always result very bad outcome. But i also think it's a lesson for the gaming industry. Why is something as core are a game engine, not something properly open-source and license such as QT, LLVM or GCC...

jimmaswell 3y ago
Redhat is evil now?
- chucksta 3y ago
  indirectly yes https://newsroom.ibm.com/2019-07-09-IBM-Closes-Landmark-Acquisition-of-Red-Hat-for-34-Billion-Defines-Open-Hybrid-Cloud-Future https://newsroom.ibm.com/2019-07-09-IBM-Closes-Landmark-Acqu... more importantly; https://www.servethehome.com/red-hat-goes-full-ibm-and-says-farewell-to-centos/ https://www.servethehome.com/red-hat-goes-full-ibm-and-says-...
- codetrotter 3y ago
  https://www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/2023/im-done-red-hat-enterprise-linux https://www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/2023/im-done-red-hat-enter...
  - thorncorona 3y ago
    Hard to run an open source enterprise company when Amazon's playbook is to take your shit for free and host it themselves.
    - azemetre 3y ago
      Wouldn't using an AGPL license be better for this than just GPL?
      - insanitybit 3y ago
        That would be a hilarious way to lose every customer over night.
        tristan957 3y ago
        Why would customers leave you if your product was AGPL?
        insanitybit 3y ago
        I think it's extremely common for companies to sit every engineer down during onboarding and say "never touch code with these licenses". Certainly in my experience it is.
        tristan957 3y ago
        MongoDB was AGPL before moving to the SSPL. So this doesn't make sense.
        withinboredom 3y ago
        Because people are stupid. Never underestimate stupidity. In all seriousness, it’s just that the AGPL considers network use to be distribution and thus entitled to the source[https://medium.com/swlh/understanding-the-agpl-the-most-misunderstood-license-86fd1fe91275 https://medium.com/swlh/understanding-the-agpl-the-most-misu...] This terrifies people for some reason. Basically because they want the freedom to modify open source projects and call it their own without giving back to the project that actually created it.
        insanitybit 3y ago
        The stupid people are lawyers and they definitely seem to think they have a good reason.
        Zuiii 3y ago
    - axus 3y ago
      Red Hat had over a billion dollars in revenue last year and it's never stopped growing. Free Red Hat-compatible operating systems did not stop them from making a lot of money.
  - OCASMv2 3y ago
    Rocky and Alma are the bad actors who caused this.
- nottorp 3y ago
  ... more like dead for all practical purposes ?
- JohnFen 3y ago
  I've considered Red Hat a bad actor for a number of years now.
bastardoperator 3y ago
Why would I even want to build a game if I'm going to have to give between 4-8% of everything I make to steam and unity? I completely understand why nearly every AAA studio builds their own client and game engine, it's cheaper in the long run.
- sebzim4500 3y ago
  Surely steam takes way more than 8%?
  - ixwt 3y ago
    Last I heard it was 30%.
- squeaky-clean 3y ago
  > it's cheaper in the long run. It depends on how much you're actually selling. Consider how much would it cost to hire devs to build your own custom engine? (Don't forget console support). Your game needs to pull in 20x higher than that in revenue for it to be worth the choice over a 5% rev share.
- qwytw 3y ago
  > 4-8% of everything To be fair Unity is asking you to give them somewhere between 0.05% and 2.5% while Steam/Apple/etc. want 30%. > AAA studio builds their own client and game engine, it's cheaper in the long run I don't think it's because of the rev share. If they were able to acquire an engine which fully suits their needs for only 5% that'd would be a great deal. Unfortunately adapting an off the shelf for a AAA game might be just as expensive as building (or at least upgrading) your own engine.
- __d 3y ago
  You know that the retail margin for a lot of products is at least 100%, right? And that's on the wholesale price, not the original cost of production. Everyone takes their cut.
mardifoufs 3y ago
Was unity ever open source? I don't think so

jimmaswell 3y ago

Redhat is evil now?

chucksta 3y ago
indirectly yes https://newsroom.ibm.com/2019-07-09-IBM-Closes-Landmark-Acquisition-of-Red-Hat-for-34-Billion-Defines-Open-Hybrid-Cloud-Future https://newsroom.ibm.com/2019-07-09-IBM-Closes-Landmark-Acqu... more importantly; https://www.servethehome.com/red-hat-goes-full-ibm-and-says-farewell-to-centos/ https://www.servethehome.com/red-hat-goes-full-ibm-and-says-...
codetrotter 3y ago
https://www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/2023/im-done-red-hat-enterprise-linux https://www.jeffgeerling.com/blog/2023/im-done-red-hat-enter...
- thorncorona 3y ago
  Hard to run an open source enterprise company when Amazon's playbook is to take your shit for free and host it themselves.
  - azemetre 3y ago
    Wouldn't using an AGPL license be better for this than just GPL?
    - insanitybit 3y ago
      That would be a hilarious way to lose every customer over night.
      - tristan957 3y ago
        Why would customers leave you if your product was AGPL?
        insanitybit 3y ago
        I think it's extremely common for companies to sit every engineer down during onboarding and say "never touch code with these licenses". Certainly in my experience it is.
        tristan957 3y ago
        MongoDB was AGPL before moving to the SSPL. So this doesn't make sense.
        withinboredom 3y ago
        Because people are stupid. Never underestimate stupidity. In all seriousness, it’s just that the AGPL considers network use to be distribution and thus entitled to the source[https://medium.com/swlh/understanding-the-agpl-the-most-misunderstood-license-86fd1fe91275 https://medium.com/swlh/understanding-the-agpl-the-most-misu...] This terrifies people for some reason. Basically because they want the freedom to modify open source projects and call it their own without giving back to the project that actually created it.
        insanitybit 3y ago
        The stupid people are lawyers and they definitely seem to think they have a good reason.
        Zuiii 3y ago
  - axus 3y ago
    Red Hat had over a billion dollars in revenue last year and it's never stopped growing. Free Red Hat-compatible operating systems did not stop them from making a lot of money.
- OCASMv2 3y ago
  Rocky and Alma are the bad actors who caused this.
nottorp 3y ago
... more like dead for all practical purposes ?
JohnFen 3y ago
I've considered Red Hat a bad actor for a number of years now.

bastardoperator 3y ago

Why would I even want to build a game if I'm going to have to give between 4-8% of everything I make to steam and unity? I completely understand why nearly every AAA studio builds their own client and game engine, it's cheaper in the long run.

sebzim4500 3y ago
Surely steam takes way more than 8%?
- ixwt 3y ago
  Last I heard it was 30%.
squeaky-clean 3y ago
> it's cheaper in the long run. It depends on how much you're actually selling. Consider how much would it cost to hire devs to build your own custom engine? (Don't forget console support). Your game needs to pull in 20x higher than that in revenue for it to be worth the choice over a 5% rev share.
qwytw 3y ago
> 4-8% of everything To be fair Unity is asking you to give them somewhere between 0.05% and 2.5% while Steam/Apple/etc. want 30%. > AAA studio builds their own client and game engine, it's cheaper in the long run I don't think it's because of the rev share. If they were able to acquire an engine which fully suits their needs for only 5% that'd would be a great deal. Unfortunately adapting an off the shelf for a AAA game might be just as expensive as building (or at least upgrading) your own engine.
__d 3y ago
You know that the retail margin for a lot of products is at least 100%, right? And that's on the wholesale price, not the original cost of production. Everyone takes their cut.

mardifoufs 3y ago

Was unity ever open source? I don't think so